Updated 12:47 pm.EST, Sun November 22, 2009

Church|Fri, Oct. 19 2007 04:03 PM EDT

Osteen Resonates in Society where Damnation Messages Don't

By Lillian Kwon|Christian Post Reporter

A Christian author has come to the defense of Joel Osteen against critics who say the megapastor's messages are “theology lite” and void of the central Christian message of the cross.

"Critics say Osteen lacks biblical references in his books and claim that he preaches prosperity gospel," said Richard Young, author of The Rise of Lakewood Church and Joel Osteen. "However, I found nearly 130 scriptural references in 'Become a Better You,' Osteen's newest book."

Three million copies of Become a Better You, published by Free Press – a division of Simon & Schuster – released nationwide on Monday along with a resurfacing of criticism as Osteen went on a national media tour this week.

"How do you react to the critics who call your message ‘theology lite?’" CNN's Larry King asked Osteen, who pastors Lakewood Church in Houston – the largest church in the country.

"I talk about forgiveness and how to have faith when bad things happen and how to overcome and love your enemies and things like that," said Osteen, alluding to situations such as those suffering with cancer or marriage troubles. “So when they say it's gospel lite, I think, you know, we're helping people where the rubber meets the road."

"We give them hope. We pray for them," Osteen emphasized. "We say God's going to give you strength."

"But, you know, how can that be gospel lite to me?" he asked. "That's why I come back to saying I'm helping people."

To critics, Osteen's latest work, which is mainly based off his sermons, is another self-help book. But Osteen says it's the principles of God's words and his book aims to reach outside church walls to those who normally don't go to church.

"I don't think you have to shove it down people's throat. You have to just present it to them. Just, you know what? The Bible is full of common sense that can help us in our everyday lives," said the megapastor Tuesday night.

Although Osteen says he believes in hell and the afterlife, he doesn't preach "fire and brimstone" and his messages often leave out the traditional Christian teachings of sacrifice, the cross of Jesus Christ, and the word "sinners."

Backing Osteen, Young acknowledged that not everyone agrees with Osteen's style, but said the megapastor encourages people to live better lives through faith in God and following Biblical principles.

"Few individuals have been as successful as Joel in spreading God's word," stated Young. "Joel understands today's culture and that messages of damnation and of a vengeful God no longer resonate with an overstressed society that already believes they are living in Hell daily.

"Instead, Joel tells people that if they draw closer to God that their lives will be better. This is a message that our society is eager to embrace. Who doesn't seek a fuller life on earth?"

Osteen calls himself a motivator who preaches a message of hope and tells people they can live a good life no matter what's happened.

And his message resonates.

His first book, Your Best Life Now, sold nearly 5 million copies, and he draws some 47,000 people to his church every weekend. Futhermore, he has 10 million television viewers tuning in every Sunday.

To Dr. Michael Horton, professor of systematic theology and apologetics at Westminster Seminary California, it isn't about filling stadiums. It's about the central gospel message.

"The Christian gospel is not determined by success, but by faithfulness to the original message of Christ and him crucified. That may not fill stadium-sized church gatherings, but it's the message that true Christianity is centered on," said Horton to CBS' "60 Minutes."

Regarding his lack of formal seminary training, Osteen pointed to Jesus' 12 disciples – some of whom were fishermen without any formal training.

"The Bible says that God chooses people that are not the most educated or the smartest, to confound other people," said Osteen on Larry King Live on Tuesday.

Osteen is currently in New York for a two-night speaking engagement at the Madison Square Garden. His Lakewood Church in Houston was ranked the largest church in the country by Outreach magazine in its annual list of America's largest and fastest-growing churches.

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  • Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:15 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I attend a megachurch in the Carolinas. It is a church for those who have been 'burned' at other churches. These folks aren't ready for solid food. They are wounded. There is a problem with the basic understanding of the gospel and our responsibility to it. Truth be known that is the case in most churches mega or not.

    The mega church model like Saddleback is to bring people into a ministry where they can overcome the wounds and begin understanding the gospel. The disciples were with Jesus for 3 years and they didn't 'get it' most of the time. Many theologians think such a high level of understanding is required to be sound doctrine. Jesus didn't. He said Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul and mind, and love your neighbor as yourself. It doesn't take 100 pounds of theology books to understand that.

    As for money, when you're living off 10% of your income and giving the other 90% to the ministry then you will have some room to throw stones......

  • Wed Apr 09, 2008 10:36 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Guys - Osteen gives you an opportunity to accept Jesus into your heart at the end of every program. He doesn't end the service without that. How many others have the opportunity to do that across national TV. People who aren't saved but on the border who like osteen are hearing that prayer over and over. What's that part in the Bible from Paul where he says one follows Paul and one follows Apollos but in all ways Christ is being preached..?? Hello!

  • Sat Dec 08, 2007 4:42 am Agree: 5   Disagree: 2

    I do have a problem with Joel Osteen saying on CNN that Jesus is not the only way to heaven and that hindus may have another way..that is NOT Biblical..he SHOULD retract that statement and make his postions clear..

  • Sat Dec 08, 2007 4:41 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    i

  • Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:14 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    one of osteens critics is Rick Warren. he disagrees with the message of health & wealth. Didn't Rick Warren take 10% of the proceeds of his book 'Purpose driven life' that sold millions. so let's say his book sold 1,000,000 x $8.00. that is $8 million & 10% of it is $800,000.
    Jesus did not charge the people a fee when he healed the sick & preached the gospel. OH, what a hypocrite Rick Warren is!

  • Wed Oct 31, 2007 10:58 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

    RBB, I apologize if I came across as judgmental. Actually I was just stating my view...which is neither right nor wrong. No judgment intended. At least we agree on the fact that God does deserve all the Glory, Honor and Praise. After all He created the universe! :)

  • RBB »
    Tue Oct 30, 2007 5:21 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    sbeitzel57 - Question... what is "resonating with our Lord Jesus Christ"?

  • Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:02 pm Agree: 5   Disagree: 6

    Boy, I'm dismayed to read so many negative comments on the manner Joel reaches out to us so we can resonate with our Lord, Jesus Christ. But, therein lies the crux. If he doesn't preach fire and brimstone then for those of you who believe this is the only way to heaven, all I can say is don't listen to him and don't judge him or those of us who do enjoy hearing the message Joel speaks of. I don't know about you, but today's society is already filled with so much insincerity, to me Joel is like a breath of fresh air and quite intuitive. I pray for all you naysayers that God will continue to inspire Joel to preach his word in a way that a lot of us can truly relate to and you will find in your hearts to see his message of hope and love that God has for us.

  • RBB »
    Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:43 am Agree: 4   Disagree: 2

    El Sali - I give God all the glory if this person was healed of anything, and I'm not judging him. I'm commenting on the fact that God has been reduced to a self help mechanism by those who fail to comprehend the gravity and magnitude of the Sovereign God of the universe. I don't understand how anyone can read the scriptures, and accept Christ, and still think of God in such small and earthly terms.

    You mistake zeal for the Living God, and wanting to see Him worshipped and recognized for who He is, for judgment of a fellow Christian. If anything, I'm hoping that my brother will come to a better understanding of the magnitude of the God he worships. Do you realize that you have judged me by the way, and falsely.

  • Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:00 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Well Jesus did heal the blind; he also said 'because of your faith you are healed'. This person that wrote the comment before, well it looks as though he has faith! So what if it was because of the fact that he couldn't afford all the costs for pills and a mental doctor anymore... then so be it. What matters is his faith in Christ. Who are we to judge how God changed him or the reasons for coming to faith in Christ Jesus? Jesus said, "for whoever is not against you is for you."

  • RBB »
    Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:27 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

    "it's working it's cheaper then being on pills and seeing a mental doctor."

    This may be the most telling thing that's been posted. God as self help. The Sovereign God of the Universe and He's not Savior, Redeemer, King, Almighty ...Praise His Holy Name.......He's cheaper than being on pills and seeing a mental doctor!

  • Sun Oct 28, 2007 9:08 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 6

    I am so Glad Joel Osteen has been brought forth at this time, In my view alot of churches have failed reaching the loss.The holy spirit within Joel has spoken life to me and my family and when I say life I mean literaly!! I wish we had a church like this in florida.I see the love of God in this man and he cares for humanity. You go Joel, keep preaching life to our dry bones it's working it's cheaper then being on pills and seeing a mental doctor.

  • Sun Oct 28, 2007 7:38 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 2

    Hello, I'd like to say that I'm a believer as of Feb. 2005. And that watching Joel and reading his book has taken my relationship with Jesus exponentially higher! The Lord has taken me places I've never even dreamed of. I believe that God has used Joel to speak insight and hope and wisdom into my life and even the message of Jesus. God bless us and keep us!

  • RBB »
    Sat Oct 27, 2007 8:54 am Agree: 9   Disagree: 6

    kstimp - I went to JoelOsteen.com as you suggested, and this is what the "what we believe" section says.....

    "The entire Bible is inspired by God, without error and the authority on which we base our faith, conduct and doctrine.
    In one God who exists in three distinct persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. We believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God who came to this earth as Savior of the world.

    Jesus died on the cross and shed His blood for our sins. We believe that salvation is found by placing our faith in what Jesus did for us on the cross. We believe Jesus rose from the dead and is coming again.

    Water baptism is a symbol of the cleansing power of the blood of Christ and a testimony to our faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

    In the regular taking of Communion as an act of remembering what the Lord Jesus did for us on the cross.

    Every believer should be in a growing relationship with Jesus by obeying God’s Word, yielding to the Holy Spirit and by being conformed to the image of Christ.

    As children of God, we are overcomers and more than conquerors and God intends for each of us to experience the abundant life He has in store for us"



    As far as I can see the problem with this is four fold. First there is no mention of the fact that we are sinners, and part of receiving forgiveness and salvation is in repenting of our sin.

    Second there is no mention of the fact that Jesus is alone the way to salvation.

    Thirdly there is no mention that those that reject Christ will go to hell.'

    Lastly the Bible passage about being more than conquerors, and our overcoming are about overcoming death and conquering sin, and the devil, through the sacrifice of Christ. It isn't about getting rewards and earthly perks here in this life.

    I just made it a point to go to my church's website and look and see if these things are mentioned. They are not. So the real question becomes....As someone who reads his books, and listens to him regularly, do you think that this is covered but simply not put down here?

  • Sat Oct 27, 2007 5:08 am Agree: 9   Disagree: 1

    The popularity behind many of the movements here discuss comes from a message that promotes "doing your own thing" and do not offend or make people feel bad. It is not about doing our own thing it is about Jesus Christ and doing what He Thinks, which is clearly stated in the Bible. And, as to wether we should be tolerant, my son is a teenager and would like me to be tolorent and see things his way even when I as an experience adult know that it is wrong. Jesus was not always tolererant as some would like us to beleive, and he comdemn those that where using His Father's house as a place to get rich. The greatest motivational speaker was Jesus Christ and He changed peoples life not by having mega meeting but by dyeing on the cross. We can not hide or comform behind a feel good, self centered message; there is a price to pay and a sacrifice to make if you we going to CONVERT people from darkness to the Light, Jesus Christ.

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 5:38 pm Agree: 7   Disagree: 1

    Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
    1 John 4:1

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 5:36 pm Agree: 6   Disagree: 1

    Excerpt taken from a commentary by Roger Oakland named The Inclusive Gospel from www.understandthetimes.org

    ".............The new evangelization program being promoted by the emerging church, while it may be in the name of Christ, is antichrist. A formula has been established to provide a bridge that has the potential to unite all religious beliefs in the name of Christ, by circumventing the gospel of Jesus Christ.

    In the future we will see all faiths join together based on a common mystical experience accompanied by “lying signs and wonders”. The apostasy the Bible warned would be apparent in the Last Days is now fully underway. Only those who hold firm to God’s Word will be protected and delivered. This remnant of faithful believers will be viewed as old-fashioned narrow-minded holdouts who are a hindrance to the establishment of the “kingdom.” As Paul wrote to Timothy, in the Last Days:

    Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution. But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. [15]"


    [15] 2 Timothy 3: 12-13

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:42 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

    Dearest Inlovewithhim,

    For your information... I know the story of the cross and who Jesus Christ is and if you went to JoelOsteen.com and went to the section called "what we believe" you will see that they do know the same story.

    If you read his book you will see many scriptures to why he believes what he believes.
    and how can you call yourself a Christian if you are the one judging people.. notice in the bible it says not to judge. You can't go around telling someone they are not a Christian just because they don't preach about the cross everyday. The WAY to heaven is to believe Jesus Christ died on the cross for your sins, and to believe in him, and never reject him.

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:48 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 4

    'it is this hateful spirit among christians that turns people off mostly.'

    No, it is the ignorant Christian that turns most people off along those who only shout REPENT or those who quote Scripture and then completely use it out of context. Those are the ones who turn everyone off... along with those who claim to be a Christian, yet refuse to use the name of Jesus Christ, like Joel here.

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:42 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Dear Kstimp,

    I would love to share the message of the cross with you if you'd like to hear it. Its a beautiful LOVE story and its the TRUTH

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:33 pm Agree: 6   Disagree: 0

    Its not TRUTH if you're leaving the MOST important message out....the message of the cross. There's only ONE WAY to Heaven and if you don't know it, you ain't getting there. I know someone who's been going to Lakewood religiously for the past two years and she still doesn't know she's not a Christian. WHY? She's never heard the message of the cross from her pastor.

    Lots of people believe they are a Christian just because they know who God is, but thats not what makes you a Christian. Everyone knows who God is, even Satan.

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:07 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    I would like to say that I highly disagree with most of the people writing comments.. I personally LOVE hearing what Joel Osteen has to say, and have been tuned into him for a few years now.. I have his book, and read it in one day because I couldn't put it down.
    I watched the 60 minutes program, and I was sadened at the way they were putting Joel down, he shouldn't have to defend himself for trying to give people hope and encouragement to be better individuals and better christians. Joel believes what he believes and it is all TRUTH whether you like to admit it or not... sometimes that's all people have is HOPE you can't take that away.
    I support Joel and Victoria 100% and can't wait to read his new book

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:11 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    Per the article:

    Although Osteen says he believes in hell and the afterlife, he doesn't preach "fire and brimstone" and his messages often leave out the traditional Christian teachings of sacrifice, the cross of Jesus Christ, and the word "sinners."

    If you leave the message of the cross of Christ, how then will anyone know the ONE WAY to get to Heaven. Our job as Christians is to bring others to CHRIST, not to make them "feel good" about their current lifestyle. That means you may have to say something that some people may not like to hear. True LOVE for mankind is telling mankind the TRUTH. Without the truth they can't really make a decision about thier destiny now can they? NOPE. Someone else is making it for them. Think about it.

    There once was a man who walked this earth and spoke a message of not only love but TRUTH. People responded. He changed lives. He brought about the biggest revival in the world. His name was Jesus. There was another man, alot like Jesus, who had the SAME message of LOVE and TRUTH. People responded. He changed lives. And he brought about the biggest revival in the world. His name was Billy Graham. Its time for another one! People need LOVE and TRUTH!

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:47 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

    Superman, I say this as tactfully, and as lovingly as I can, but do you sincerely think that all natural disasters are strictly because of man's mismanagement of the worlds resources? Don't you think that the God of Creation, the God of the Book of Revelation, and the God of the World Wide Flood in Genesis which will judge all of mankind in the last days because of their obstinate rebellion and continual rejection of His Son is not Sovereign? Read the Bible in context, and then comment on it. The post modern liberal Emergent church, and it's seeker sensitive counterparts want people to believe that if we all save the environment, and save the whales, the events of the Book of Revelation will not happen, and we can actually prevent it from happening. A similar social gospel which claims that we should make the world a better place, and usher in peace prior to Jesus' second coming; it has been adopted by Rick Warren, and has caused whole splits in the Southern Baptist Convention, because he has gone down the Purpose Driven P.E.A.C.E Plan agenda, which by the way is a false doctrine my friend. These movements which align themselves with Bono from U2 and the whole COEXIST crowd have more in common with humanism, one world religeon, and the new age than what the Bible says will transpire. The problem today is that we have so many "Bible teachers" who are more motivational speakers than true shepherd's of the flock of God. No wonder the Body of Christ is split. The Bible talks of a great falling away in the end times. Men will naturally gravitate towards what their "itching ears" want to hear. What more itching do you need than what you hear on TBN, and the like: "find success", "you are the controller of your own destiny" "God will prosper you if you just have faith [and send me your money]". They take Scripture outr of context to suit their own desires, and fleece the flock of God for their own matierial gain. I have not studied Joel Olsteen much, becuase the times I have watched him, he appeared to preach a watered-down social gospel, but I will tell you, OPEN YOUR EYES and STUDY the WORD IN CONTEXT.

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 9:28 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    people who dont stand up to represent Jesus themselves coming forward to criticize those who do. why criticize? do your own thing and lets see how you will fare. it is this hateful spirit among christians that turns people off mostly. it is obvious to see that pastor osteen has stayed true to his calling and jealousy and envy is a bye product of success. Jesus never condenmed people who were seeking, He only condenmed those who were "fat": full of themselves and their antagonistic theology. by the way, natural disasters are a result of mankind's mismanagement of the earth and its resources. God takes no pleasure in seeing people suffer. the scriptures say," He is light, and in Him is no darkness at all". the power of choice we have is responsible for our outcomes. chose to love, chose tolerance, chose to speak the truth in love. stop being hateful in the name of God, you are on your own

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 7:36 am Agree: 4   Disagree: 1

    27 times God is mentioned and 0 times is Jesus ever mentioned. I think this speaks volumes on its own without having to read through the self-help 'all about ME' sermon that Joel is spewing.

  • Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:28 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "... the wrath of God is revealed..."

    http://poleblog.polemos.net/2007/10/wrath-of-god-is-revealed.html

  • Thu Oct 25, 2007 3:55 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

    The video and transcript of the interview with Joel and Victoria Osteen are here:

    Joel & Victoria Osteen on Finding Faith and Dealing with Calif. Wildfires

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,305002,00.html

    There is so much error in what these two people say in there it is not funny. They are deceived and are deceiving millions of others. Imo, they are wolves in sheep's clothing. It is tragic that America is promoting these two false teachers. The news media love them because they do not preach the "true-truth." Joel and Victoria Osteen are obscuring the full-orbed gospel. Their gospel message is a man centered, man focused gospel which is no gospel at all. Joel and Victoria do not give God all the glory alone. Joel and Victoria Osteen's faith is in their own faith rather than all faith in God.

    God help America.

  • Thu Oct 25, 2007 3:27 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    "Has anyone seen the FOX news interview - more fluff - and on top of that Joel Osteen's wife is not sure if God is responsible for Natural Disasters."

    Talking about natural disasters, has anyone seen this yet? >>>

    What Does God Have To Do With Disaster?

    "So, what do you think of when a major natural disaster strikes, when thousands are killed, homes destroyed, and crime and looting run rampant. What about when epidemics of deadly disease strike? What do you say to people who ask you, "What kind of a god would do such a thing?". What do you say to people who ask such things of you? Do you believe that God is behind such things or do you believe that these things are somehow happening outside the will of God? Do you believe that God simply allows these things to happen or do you believe there's more to it than that? If you were to ask a Christian from centuries ago these questions, you'd probably get a different answer than you would from today's Christians. So who is right?"

    Continued here:

    http://www.oldtruth.com/blog.cfm/id.2.pid.813

    SolaScriptura,

    is there a link to that Fox news interview clip on the Net? Thanks.

  • Thu Oct 25, 2007 1:05 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    JFORD,

    The only reason why I was asking why you were shouting is because you were typing in all caps. No worries though my friend!

  • Thu Oct 25, 2007 10:44 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

    Has anyone seen the FOX news interview - more fluff - and on top of that Joel Osteen's wife is not sure if God is responsible for Natural Disasters - Haha guess God's not sovereign - Guess the flood in Genesis 6 was convenient for God then (yeah right).

  • RBB »
    Thu Oct 25, 2007 6:27 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    That is a great article, thanks for posting it. It's true.....even when you know something is wrong biblically, you hesitate to say it these days.

    I grew up in a church that interpreted scripture "the red fire engine" way..... Won't get fooled again.

  • Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:53 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

    We as Christians have a "right and a obligation" to critique Joel Osteen's false teachings and warn others of what he is doing. Joel Osteen needs to seriously repent of the sin of concealing more than half of the truth. Those who follow Joel Osteen need to study their Bibles for their very lives, their eternal lives even, their eternal destinies hangs upon it. If we truly love Joel Osteen, we will pray for him, pray that God opens his eyes to what he really is doing wrong, and if we get the opportunity, warn him to flee the wrath of God that is coming.

    TO JUDGE OR NOT TO JUDGE:
    THE RIGHTS AND WRONGS OF BIBLICAL DISCERNMENT
    by G. Richard Fisher

    "It seems clear, since Jesus Himself said, “Judge not,” (Matthew 7:1), that we cannot “judge.” At first glance it appears that Jesus not only forbids judging others, but that He catches Himself in a glaring contradiction.

    Verse 1 seems obvious, “Judge not,” yet in verses 6, 15-16, we are to judge “swine,” “dogs,” and the “fruit” of false apostles. How do we reconcile this apparent contradiction? Do we judge or not?

    Churches have split along lines of those who wish to make judgments and those who say we cannot. One side accuses the other of being legalistic and loveless while the other side is called liberal and spineless.

    Rooting out the truth on this subject is essential and a thorough search will reveal that there are different kinds of judgment taught in Scripture. One form we are commanded to do; the other we are forbidden to do. Both sides could be right and wrong depending on what they are talking about. One could not read Matthew 18:16-18 seriously and conclude that we never judge anything. In 1 Corinthians 5 Paul takes the people of God to task for not judging the right things the right way.

    One of the biggest issues in the Church is how we arrive at truth. We have churches that think frenzied laughter is a way to worship God, while other churches conduct services that sound like a barnyard. Our land is dotted with Word-Faith proponents that see God as the great vending machine in the sky. All of the groups in this confusing mix say they are preaching the truth and being led by the Spirit.

    It is also obvious that some arrive at truth in the same fashion as the poem, “Why Are Fire Engines Red?”

    They have four wheels and eight men
    four plus eight is twelve
    twelve inches make a ruler
    a ruler is Queen Elizabeth
    Queen Elizabeth sails the seven seas
    the seven seas have fish
    the fish have fins
    The Finns hate the Russians
    the Russians are red
    Fire engines are always rushin’
    So they’re red.

    Some groups handle the Bible in much the same way.

    Let’s consider four major points to help us unravel the question: When to judge and when not to judge?"

    Continued here:

    http://www.pfo.org/notjudge.htm

  • Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:40 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    "To the Christian “critics”, while I know that your intentions are in defense of the kingdom, not one of us has a right to point an accusing finger at an anointed one of God. 1 Sam 24: 6&9 David would not harm Saul because regardless of the latter’s falling out of God’s favor, the fact that God had anointed him made him untouchable."

    You have taken the Scriptures completely out of context.

    The Untouchables
    by Hank Hanegraaff

    "During His Sermon on the Mount, Jesus Christ exhorted His followers not to judge self-righteously or hypocritically. Is this necessarily what Christians do when they question the teachings of God's "anointed" preachers and evangelists? Many teachers who claim such anointing would say so, and many more of their followers commonly reply to all manner of criticism: "Touch not God's anointed."

    Some of these teachers add that such actions carry literally grave consequences. Prominent "faith" teacher Kenneth Copeland affirmed in his taped message, "Why All Are Not Healed": "There are people attempting to sit in judgment right today over the ministry that I'm responsible for, and the ministry that Kenneth E. Hagin is responsible for....Several people that I know had criticized and called that faith bunch out of Tulsa a cult. And some of 'em are dead right today in an early grave because of it, and there's more than one of them got cancer."

    In addition to certain "word-faith" teachers, such sentiments may be found among various groups involved with shepherding and other forms of authoritarian rule (from diverse "five-fold" ministries to a host of large and small "fringe churches"). The leaders of these groups are commonly regarded as having a unique gift and calling that entitles them to unconditional authority. To dispute any of their words or deeds is not distinguished from questioning God Himself.

    Advocates of such authority assume that Scripture supports their view. Their key biblical proof text is Psalm 105:15: "Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm" (KJV). But a close examination of this passage reveals that it has nothing to do with challenging the teachings of church leaders."

    Continued here:

    http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/Bible_Answer_Man/Article.asp?article_id=129

  • Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:02 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

    No, Jesus spoke more about Hell than He did about Heaven. Joel needs to tell the WHOLE story not just what he likes to talk about - what sells his books.

  • Wed Oct 24, 2007 1:41 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    ZENODADDY!.. WHY WOULD YOU TAKE IT AS IM SHOUTING, NOT AT ALL. YOU HAVE A GREAT DAY!...

  • Wed Oct 24, 2007 12:41 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    Dear Brother Osteen! I can only hope that someway, somehow this open letter gets through to you amidst what I am sure is thousands of mails you get everyday. I caught a snippet of your interview with Larry King and have read comments from “critics” and supporters; I would like to both encourage you for the good work you are doing because God has indeed anointed you as his prophet BUT at the same time share some concerns I have about your stance on certain issues that are 100% contrary to the will of God – issues such as homosexuality.
    To the Christian “critics”, while I know that your intentions are in defense of the kingdom, not one of us has a right to point an accusing finger at an anointed one of God. 1 Sam 24: 6&9 David would not harm Saul because regardless of the latter’s falling out of God’s favor, the fact that God had anointed him made him untouchable. Jeroboam’s hand withered when he pointed at and commanded the arrest of another man of God in the book of Kings. There are numerous examples in the bible – God has a special relationship with His anointed, whether they are walking in His way or not. So let us stop “criticisms” against any man of God; he will settle his account privately with God. Pastor Osteen, my words of encouragement are that you watch yourself to continually walk in the PERFECT will of God. Our Lord is a God of details and not of confusion. Millions of people watch and listen to your words as a man of God (Matt 5:14 “You are the light of the world.”). So when you don’t explicitly denounce that which the Lord has denounced, those in sin feel good, those looking for answers in Christ get confused and those of us who are striving to grow in Christ become “critics” – a sin against the man of God and God himself. Our Lord God is too Holy and cannot abide sin. He destroyed Sodom & Gomorah and 99% of the tribe of Benjamin because of their perverteous ways. God created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve. He does not conform to humanity for His ways are far above our ways, as heaven is far from earth and His thoughts far greater than our thoughts. He will not bring Himself down to our level. So, if the world today says homosexuality is permitted, the Lord God has no qualms about wiping out the whole world if he cannot find a righteous one that COMPLETELY walks in His will. So stand firm and be strong – PLEASE PREACH IT LIKE IT IS – SCRIPTURALLY & UNDILUTED! Saul lost it because he feared persecution of man rather than of God (1 Sam 15:24). My prayer is that the Lord God will give you the grace to stand firm in HIS WORD. When Larry King asked you about your stance on homosexuality for instance, I would have loved it if you’d come out clearly to denounce it! God loves us all, but He WILL NOT compromise Himself nor make Himself a liar for our sakes. With all the calamity going on all around us today, we Christians need to stand up and be counted. NO MORE COMPROMISE!Deut 10:12

  • Wed Oct 24, 2007 10:51 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    JFORD,

    Why are you shouting?

  • Wed Oct 24, 2007 10:35 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 2

    ITS A SHAME HOW WE AS PEOPLE SPEND ALOT OF TIME JUDGEING OTHERS AND WHAT THEY ARE DOING INSTEAD OF FOCUSING ON OURSELVES. WHETHER JOEL IS SPEAKING ON DAMNATION AND HELL OR BEING POSITIVE PEOPLE WILL NEVER BE HAPPY WITH WHAT HE IS DOING, AND WILL ALWAYS FIND SOMETHING NEGATIVE TO SAY. PREACHERS AND MINISTERS PREACH ON DIFFERENT THINGS AND HAVE DIFFERENT STYLES. ALOT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE STUCK ON THE TRADITIONAL WAY OF HOW YOU THE WORD OF GOD SHOULD BE PREACHED AND TEACHED DONT EVEN APPLY IT TO THEIR EVERYDAY LIFE THEMSELVES.. SO WHY EVEN HAVE ANYTHING TO SAY. DENOMINATIONS WERE CREATED BY MAN AND A CHRISTIAN IS A CHRISTIAN , AN INDIVIUAL WHO BELIEVES THAT JESUS CHRIST WAS CRUCIFIED TO SAVE US FROM OUR SINS. JOEL DOESNT HAVE TO PREACH HELL AND DAMNATION BECAUSE FOR THOSE WHO HAVE MUCH TO SAY SHOULD KNOW BETTER ANYWAY. GET IN THE WORD (BIBLE) FOR YOURSELF AND LEARN/APPLY WHAT IS EXPECTED OF YOU, DONT BE MAD AT JOEL FOR BEING HAPPY AND GOD BLESSING HIM. BECAUSE IF YOU SEEK WHAT HE'S SEEKING YOU TO WILL BE AT PEACE AND HAPPY.

  • Tue Oct 23, 2007 9:36 pm Agree: 7   Disagree: 1

    For those of you who don't believe that we should be watching out for motivational speaking/social gospel with an emergent friendly theme, please check out who Willow Creek has invited to speak. Here's the link: http://www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com/blog/index.php?cat=19. We need to preach sound doctrine in our churches; not psychobabble meant to tickle the ears of men.

  • Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:57 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    Hey, RBB, don't be knockin' feel good, self-help, man-discovered good news! It's actually quite effective and healing, dontcha know?

  • RBB »
    Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:49 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 2

    treelucas-
    "We all should Thank God for the impact that all True Pastors have in our society."

    Amen. They would be the ones that preach the actual gospel of Christ.


    "they handed Jesus over because of envy."

    Wow now there is a total misuse of a scripture. No one is complaining because Joel's making money from his book or his church, they are wanting him to preach the gospel and not a feel good, self help, manmade gospel.

  • Tue Oct 23, 2007 5:29 pm Agree: 5   Disagree: 3

    I am amazed that a Pastor is yet the target of other Christians - in 2007!. The American Church had better repent of its deep-rooted sin, namely the sin of ENVY!

    We read in Matthew 27:18b that "they handed Jesus over because of envy."

    We all should Thank God for the impact that all True Pastors have in our society. Again in the Gospel of Matthew, Chapter 7, Verse 1 warns of the danger of judging another of God's Prized Creations: Mankind. IF one judges, he or she stands qualified to be judged also. Let us examine ourselves in order to partake of the Holy Communion in the proper manner (and on a regular basis - in an effort to remain pure). 1 Cor. Chapter 11 warns of the consequences that pertain to partaking of the Lord's Body and Blood in a manner unworthy - sickness and death are the possible results!

    Saints, please ask for God's mercy and let us all press for the prize of the High Call of God in Christ. It appears to me that Pastor Osteen has found the perfect will of God for his life - I rejoice with him in his success that is promised if we keep our mind and heart fixed on The Living Word - Jesus, The King of the Jews (Joshua 1:8b). A true disciple is effective, inspirational, powerful, and will win many souls for the King - that is what we must do. God Bless all of you.

    Everyone that believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the Father, loves his child as well. This is how we will know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out His Commands (1 John 5:1-2). Lastly, His Comands aren't burdensome.

    All of God's messengers through the ages have demonstrated an unusual annointing in their day. Pastors- Joel Osteen, Billy Graham, Greg Laurie, and many others have found their purpose in life by the Amazing Grace of God! Let us join the number who "Take Up His Cross and Follow Jesus!" Please forgive me if I've mispelled anyone's name.

    All Praises to God and Comfort in the Holy Ghost. Amen

  • Tue Oct 23, 2007 3:53 pm Agree: 7   Disagree: 1

    Hmmm...so Billy Graham, who has preached the same message of hell and repentance for over 40 years, and led thousands to Jesus Christ, as has Greg Laurie and Franklin, has been giving the wrong message?.

    Here's an observable fact: human nature is to flock where your ears get tickled the most. And it looks like brother Joel is tickling a lot of ears.

    And for the record, Christ didn't soften his message, He simply new how to effectively present it that left the hearer without rebuttal.

  • Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:45 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 3

    Matthew 11:28"Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30For my yoke is easy and my burden is light."

    Jesus did not shy away from the consequences of an unrepentant heart...but his chief message is of peace and joy. Of feeling good, and as Paul said, "accomplish all things through Christ who strengthens ME"
    Preach on, Brother Joel. And keep your eyes on Jesus, who came "not to condemn the world but to save the world." .

  • Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:13 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    Prophet: Can you support your comments with Scripture and even better Scripture in its proper context

  • RBB »
    Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:40 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    It's great to have Ingrid back. I just discovered she was up and running again this morning.

  • Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:10 pm Agree: 5   Disagree: 1

    A Christian author has come to the defense of Joel Osteen against critics who say the megapastor's messages are “theology lite” and void of the central Christian message of the cross.

    "Critics say Osteen lacks biblical references in his books and claim that he preaches prosperity gospel," said Richard Young, author of The Rise of Lakewood Church and Joel Osteen. "However, I found nearly 130 scriptural references in 'Become a Better You,' Osteen's newest book."

    Author Sends Out Press Release Defense of Osteen
    http://www.sliceoflaodicea.com/?p=28

    "Mr. Young, Osteen’s using 130 Scriptures doesn’t mean a thing when it comes to biblical orthodoxy. Satan’s greatest successes have involved the rise of leaders who copiously quote the Scriptures to make their own heretical points. Scripture is not to be treated as a source for proof texts for false teaching. Osteen has no biblical defense for his ‘best life now’, ‘God wants you to be a success’ message. In fact, Osteen’s message runs counter to Christ’s clear command that we deny ourselves, take up our crosses and follow Him. There is no personal cross in Osteen’s message to the world, only a better, more effective ME. He has people raise a Bible over their heads at the start of his messages to assure everyone that he believes the Word of God. Then he proceeds to completely contradict the very Word he claims to follow. We are here on this planet for God’s glory, not our own. God does not want us on a journey of deeper “self-discovery” as Osteen claims in his new book. He wants us to go deeper and deeper into the knowledge of His Son, Jesus Christ. We are to decrease and Christ must increase in our lives. This biblical framework runs counter to everything that Osteen represents. Your press release only confirms in my mind, Mr. Young, that Joel Osteen needs to repent of his false teaching and his man-centered gospel and stop misleading the millions of people who follow his ministry. He is a false teacher and the consequences are eternal."

    Full article here:

    http://www.sliceoflaodicea.com/?p=28

  • RBB »
    Mon Oct 22, 2007 5:38 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 0

    There's a big difference between condemning, and saying that someone isn't preaching the whole gospel, or putting in things that are not there, or preaching something that is in opposition to what the Bible says to do.

    How can preaching something unbiblical be part of what we are supposed to do?

  • NOTW »
    Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:52 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Jesus will separate His sheep from the goats, just as the LORD promised through His prophet Ezekiel--He will do it Himself. Foolish goats will eat anything. The message from false teachers such as this should reveal the idols set up in the hearts of those who would desire God. This would bring repentance in the truly reborn. The rest are chaff, tares, fruitless vines for the fire. "Little children, keep yourselves from idols."

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