Worst Christian Persecution Expected in Saudi Arabia, N. Korea

citsonga »

Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:03 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 3

I flagged myself, didnt like what i wrote.

Chris333 »

Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:26 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

As for Christianity, by Jesus' very words He said that all that live by the sword die by the sword, and Christianity primarily grew by persecution in its early period (before becoming the state religion). It is clear from the Bible that force is never to be used in showing others the message of Christ, and that we are not to discriminate based on religion. Islam shows no such view, in its extremist form. An example is the fact that Christianity is either illegal or highly discriminated in almost all Middle Eastern countries. I will not deny that many Muslims are peace loving, I know many Muslims and I can attest that they are very peace loving (granted most are American or studying abroad). However you do have massive demonstrations in Sudan when a teacher lets her Muslim students name a teddy bear Muhammad, which call for her death, with multitudes waving swords and calling for her execution. Oh yes but they are only angry because the west exploited them! Give me a break it is laughable to say something like that. On one point I can definitely agree with you, and that is the strikingly selfish and greedy actions of western governments, not just towards the ME but to nearly every poor region in the world. As a Christian I find it horrible. You need to study Christianity and realize that Christianity does not equal the west. This goes for your statement about settlers and Indians as well. God never gave Christians the ability to force heathens into the faith. Conquering lands is also unChristian. You have failed to show even one example of Christians persecuting Muslims. You have only showed false examples that were more for economic gain or strategic gain than anything else. If anything you have shown how secularism is bad. You shouldn't judge a world view by its abuse, and you should remember that by blaming Christianity (for something it is not at fault for) is neglecting the fact that people are being tortured and killed as we speak for what they believe, they need our help not our personal agendas.

Chris333 »

Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:25 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

Well Citsonga,

Why did you give the US attacking the Middle East as an example of Christians persecuting Muslims if you knew it wasn't true? What difference does it matter how certain Middle Easterners view this as Christians attacking them? That doesn't make it a correct example. Also, simply because terrorists come primarily if not exclusively from Muslim countries does not mean that America attacked the Middle East because they are Muslim, you are twisting information to fit your agenda. I resent your statement that I "vilify" Muslims, I do no such thing. I said that Islam, does allow these things to happen and that Christianity does not. This is not villifying Muslims in any way, it is only giving a straightforward interpretation of the life of Muhammad and the Quran and Hadith. Yes in the Medina period Muhammad spoke greatly about peace, but when he got more power his attitude clearly changed, as can be seen from his killing of Jews within the city, and also frequent raiding that took place. Also the idea that the surrounding areas had to be conquered by the sword if necessary. You say you have been studying Middle Eastern History for some time now, please do not try to pretend like this didn't happen.

citsonga »

Mon Jan 14, 2008 6:29 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

Well chris, you missed it again. Of course I dont consider the US a Christian nation, thats why I put it in quotes. Millions of Americans unfortunately do consider the US a Christian nation, thats why their always trying to breakdown separation of church and state. The reason I stated "persecution of Muslims by Christian's" is exactly how Muslims of the ME now view the US as it now occupies two predominately Muslims countries, Afghanistan and Iraq, and threatens to attack another- Iran. I also see everyday how Americans vilify Muslims. You yourself do it in your posts. You, and most Americans consider Muslims to be violent. Just as there are violent and extremist Christians, the same applies to Muslims. Most Muslims are peace loving and want nothing more than to have a happy and peaceful life. Unfortunately, there are the extremist elements that create problems. I have to say though, that the extremists are largely the product of repressive regimes in the ME, that resulted in the growth of Islamic extremism. The US and the West are responsible for much of this as the US and Britain primarily, have impeded the development of democratic institutions in the ME and have instead, for the sake of expediency to protect OIL interests, supported these dictators such as the Shah of Iran, Saddam Hussein and the corrupt and autocratic royal family of Saudi Arabia.
I will say it again to you. You really need to study the dreadful history of the West in the ME , post Ottoman Empire primarily. If you have an objective mind, you would come around to agreeing with at least some of what I have stated.


"Christianity DOES NOT allow for bombing and killing of innocent people, nor does it allow for forcing others to believe in its way"

Isn't this what the Christian Europeans did to the indigenous peoples of the Americas as they conquered their lands and attemted to convert the 'heathens" to Christianity?

Chris333 »

Mon Jan 14, 2008 6:01 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

citsonga,

You go too far, America is no Christian nation, if there ever could be such a thing. Christianity DOES NOT allow for bombing and killing of innocent people, nor does it allow for forcing others to believe in its way. Islam does allow the killing of infidels and does at least permit these atrocities that are happening. Also, atheism is mum on this if not antagonistic. Atheism just says "whatever you want". You made a false accusation, and then you didnt even bring a solution in. Persecution of Muslims by Christians? Do you know what the word persecution even means? It means to oppress another for their faith. You said Christians persecute Muslims, and then said they attack them for their oil. Not a single thing you said was right. Secular motives if anything would be behind such an attack, and it would not be because the other people are Muslim either, not once did anyone even suggest that this war was because the Middle Eastern people were Muslim. Try thinking about what you are saying rather than just trying to point a finger at Christians for something.

citsonga »

Fri Jan 11, 2008 7:32 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 8

Lets not forget persecution of Muslims by Christians. After all it is a "Christian" nation (US) that drops bombs on innocent people in Iraq and Afghanistan. It has been a Christian nation that has imposed its will on Middle Eastern Islamic countries for decades to secure its oil interests. Let us not forget the brutal Shah of Iran who was installed as the puppet dictator by and for the United States in order to get their oil, resulting in the persecution of its mainly Islamic population.

citsonga »

Fri Jan 11, 2008 7:22 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

mcfbc: "Why do we continue to put up with abuses by Saudi Arabia."

Two Big reasons:

1. OIL
2 The US & Bush family business partners of Saudi's for decades.

The US and the bush family have been business partners with corrupt royal family for decades. The US govenment and business's sell the Saudi's weapon systems and protect them with the vast US war machine. They sell us oil.

maranatha7593 »

Wed Jan 09, 2008 2:24 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

So true, gavulav. One great resource for learning more and helping these brothers and sisters through prayer and in other ways is www.opendoors.org - which was smuggling Bibles into communist countries 'way back in the '50s and has never stopped ministering to God's people around the world, especially the persecuted church.

nuana »

Tue Jan 08, 2008 5:05 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

I would like to know more about the Release International. I want to know how I too can get more involved in helping any way that I can. They are my family, and no one messes with my family.

SummaTheologica »

Tue Jan 08, 2008 2:25 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

I think we are trying to take the Moral Highground, I.E. WWJD?

gavulav »

Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:30 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

This is another praying situation for us. We seem so powerless in the face of so much persecution of our Christian brothers and sisters living in communist, muslim and buddhist countries. Our hope is in God. We just take everything to God in prayer. Look at what happened to the great Soviet Union - it was brought to its knees through the anguished cry and prayer of the saints. God will do it again to these countries that dare to trifle with the apple of God's eye!

mcfbc »

Tue Jan 08, 2008 11:40 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

Why do we continue to put up with abuses by Saudi Arabia. They can abuse Chrstians and train as many terrorists as they want. Just keep that oil flowing. That's the god we worship.