BEIRUT, Lebanon (AP) - A Saudi blogger has made a short video featuring alleged Christian extremists preaching violence and a Bible passage calling for war, in response to an anti-Quran film that sparked protests across the Muslim world.
Raed al-Saeed told The Associated Press on Thursday that the purpose of his six-minute video is to show Islam should not be judged by watching Dutch filmmaker Geert Wilders' movie "Fitna," which links terror attacks by Muslim extremists with texts from the Quran.
"It is easy to take parts of any holy book that are out of (context) and make it sound like the most inhumane book ever written," al-Saeed said in a statement posted at the end of his video. "This is what Geert Wilders did to gather more supporters to his hateful ideology. To create schism."
Al-Saeed, 33, said he lifted footage showing alleged Christian extremists and British soldiers beating up Iraqis from YouTube and used the same methods Wilders did. The video appeared to include footage from "Jesus Camp," an American documentary about a summer camp for evangelical Christians that was nominated for a 2007 Academy Award.
However, al-Saeed said his movie, entitled "Schism," was not directed against Christians.
Wilders' film has angered Muslims around the world, sparking angry street protests in several countries and triggering calls for a boycott of Dutch goods.
Within 12 hours of posting, al-Saeed said his video was removed from YouTube in Saudi Arabia with a message from the site saying the content was inappropriate.
"I sent it again with a message saying, 'Before you delete Schism, look at Fitna. Delete both if you deem them inappropriate,'" he said.
Late Thursday, al-Saeed's video still could be accessed on YouTube and other Web sites, he said, adding that it had been viewed by more than 5,000 users.
Copyright 2008 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
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Let's now get the ugly truth about Islam. This is a video that exposes the blindness of western nations to the deceptions of ISLAM and those who defend it.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-871902797772997781&ql
Listen to this former islamic terrorist speak on these two youtube videos about islam:
"Why they want to kill us"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LlyKzojYows
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVF2pcavxzQ
Let's now get the ugly truth about about Islam. This is a video that exposes the blindness of western nations to the deceptions of ISLAM and those who defend it.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-871902797772997781&ql
Listen to this former islamic Terrorist speak on these two youtube about islam:
"Why they want to kill us"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LlyKzojYows
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVF2pcavxzQ
I think this Muslim dog is actually barking on a wrong tree.
The faith of Geerts Wilders is not Christian, but actually secular specifically anti immigrant.
Thus for any Muslim trying to relate them, please do your homework first. Or better yet, try reading lots more than the 2 pages information in Arabic from your dhumb uztadz.
Scitsonga,
Thanks for admitting some misunderstandings and conceeding some points. Too often we are too prideful to accept another's side (myself included). That being said, I would like to comment on one thing you said.
" I still maintain the aforementioned passage does raise some questions that perhaps I am not willing to delve deeper into to understand, perhaps it does mean something different than what I am reading into. But again, i really am not a believer and I think people sometimes read into things and get what they want out of it. We all have our biases. That perhaps is the problem with parables if thats what the passage is."
This is all true, but if I attribute something wrongly to Islam, based upon taking something out of context, the world explodes, and secular professors and speakers will condemn me. Yet when someone does this to Christians, secular people just snicker and laugh to themselves, or at least they don't say anything. It is a double standard against Christians, and it almost amounts to religious discrimination.
That being said, the Bible is abundantly clear on this point, if a Christian tried to use the passage you and this Muslim have quoted to justify violence, I would tell him he was not a Christian. It is really ridiculous to try to use faith in Christ for violence, Christ condemned violence. Now the same does not apply for Islam. The Quran, Hadith, and Shariah Law are very pro-violence, in the literal sense, and it is extremely clear from the context that they do support violence. If you want to make Islam into a religion of peace, then you need to scrap the Hadith, vastly alter Shariah law, and rip out a few pages from the Quran. This is not really up for debate, as the Quran does not leave room for debate, it is clear.
Chris,
Thanks for your comments. First off, you haven't offended me or have been mean. Much of what you have stated I disagree with simply because I am not really a believer, and I am probably on very shaky grounds when I go quoting material from the Bible. But I still maintain the aforementioned passage does raise some questions that perhaps I am not willing to delve deeper into to understand, perhaps it does mean something different than what I am reading into. But again, i really am not a believer and I think people sometimes read into things and get what they want out of it. We all have our biases. That perhaps is the problem with parables if thats what the passage is.
You make a very good point concerning King, Ghandi, etc and the sacrifices they and their families made for the causes they struggled for. My choice of fanatic and communist not good choice of words. Actually I had something else kind of in mind when I made the statement, but your point is well taken.
I actually had a much longer response to your post, but I by mistake deleted it before I finished and had to mostly start over and i am too tired to do it all over at this time.
Creed, Thanks for taking the time to comment on my post, please see my message to Chris above and you will know where I am coming from. As I stated above, i had a much longer response but mistakingly deleted before it got sent and am just too tired right now to do it ALL over again, but thanks again for your thoughts.
I flagged myself for errors
Scitsonga (Part 1),
"Chris, I take a simpler interpretation of Matthew 10, 34-35, as it is written, the passage to me is frightening and threatening."
Oh, I am sorry, I expected others to hold higher standards in criticism, but it is your right to be lazy and take things out of context! By all means! (Do not expect me to take you seriously though)
"Why the cryptic language then, you interpret sword as "the word of God". Why didn't Jesus just say that if thats what he meant."
Because of the fact that the only description of the sword ever given in the New Testament is the Word of God, as well as the fact that Christ condemned all usage of violence and specifically a "sword". I actually try to interpret things "in context" but you have already established that you do not do this, so I have no way of debating with you.
"Again, I interpret as it is written."
No, you interpret it out of context, with your own bias. If you interpreted it as it is written, then you would look for a description of this "sword". Which Paul calls the sword that (figuratively) divides "soul and spirit" which he refers to as the Word of God.
"I dont know anyone that does that, except for a die hard communist or a fanatic of sorts, it wouldn't be good for the family to put an ideal or religion ahead of the priorities of the family."
Martin Luther King, Ghandi, the Buddha, Mother Theresa, hundreds upon thousands of individuals engaged in world peace programs and movements who put world peace or the needs of others over their own, and their biological families. Imagine if Martin Luther said, "Well, it might put my family in danger, and my not being there would be really bad for them, I will put my family above equality" The U.S might still be segregated today! But he made a sacrifice, he sacrificed himself, and his role in his family, he put the ideal over his family. I suppose you think him evil though, because you only interpret things narrowly and out of context...
Scitsonga (Part 2)
"I dont know anyone that does that, except for a die hard communist or a fanatic of sorts, it wouldn't be good for the family to put an ideal or religion ahead of the priorities of the family."
Martin Luther King, Ghandi, the Buddha, Mother Theresa, hundreds upon thousands of individuals engaged in world peace programs and movements who put world peace or the needs of others over their own, and their biological families. Imagine if Martin Luther said, "Well, it might put my family in danger, and my not being there would be really bad for them, I will put my family above equality" The U.S might still be segregated today! But he made a sacrifice, he sacrificed himself, and his role in his family, he put the ideal over his family. I suppose you think him evil though, because you only interpret things narrowly and out of context...
"I guess I dont understand the thing with worship. Why would God require or even be interested in lowly humans that are but a speck in a universe billions of light years in size containing billions of galaxies to worship the creator, makes no sense, at least to me. "
Finally, a genuine concern. I am sorry if I may have offended you with the above, but I enjoy intelligent discussions (and I assume you do as well), and we must have higher standards for an intelligent discussion to be possible. I think your problem here lies in giving respect to persons. We rightly say that it is good to give respect to a person who is older (in most cases), and we rightly say that it is good to give respect to a person who has done a great deal for this planet, and the betterment of humanity. These forms of respect are contingent, upon age or merit. It only naturally follows that God would deserve the ultimate form of respect (if He exists), because He exists eternally, and because He has given us everything (our very existence is contingent upon Him). We would think it wrong to be rude to our teacher, or to someone like Ghandi, we might say it is insolent not to give some form of respect to such a great person, it is infinitely so with God. It has little to do with how important we are, it has everything to do with how important God is.
Hi scitsonga,
I’m not sure how much of the Holy Bible you have read but it does say that He reviles Himself to babes (uneducated) but confuses the wise and that you don’t throw perils before swine meaning that you don’t give good things to someone who will not appreciate it or take care of it. Like giving a 16 year old a 150k Porsche or Ferrari for example.
Yes, you should take the Holy Bible literally but you also should know that Jesus spoke in parables for the reasons given above. When someone has accepted Jesus as Lord and Savior and, confessed to Him that he/she is a sinner and asked for forgiveness then the Holy Spirit will teach you as you grow in understanding of our Lords words.
For the comment of the “fanatic or sorts” as you call them. The best was to explain that you should not love anyone or thing more than the Lord is best said by our lord. You cannot have two masters for you will love one and hate the other. If you had tow thing that you love greatly but the two were at odds with each other than you would have to chose between one over the other.
For the Worship thing, we worship God Almighty because:
a) He is interested in our lives
b) Jesus died on the cross for our sins so that we would not be separated from him eternally
c) (The most important reason) He loves us so much that while we were His enemies He still scarifies His only begotten Son. His Son paid for our sins by his death so that we may live with Him forever. That none shall parish but all will come to the saving knowledge of Christ our Savior.
If you have any more questions, please let me know.
Chris, I take a simpler interpretation of Matthew 10, 34-35, as it is written, the passage to me is frightening and threatening. Why the cryptic language then, you interpret sword as "the word of God". Why didn't Jesus just say that if thats what he meant. Again, I interpret as it is written.
"and sacrifice their human relationships for the betterment of humanity"
I dont know anyone that does that, except for a die hard communist or a fanatic of sorts, it wouldn't be good for the family to put an ideal or religion ahead of the priorities of the family.
I guess I dont understand the thing with worship. Why would God require or even be interested in lowly humans that are but a speck in a universe billions of light years in size containing billions of galaxies to worship the creator, makes no sense, at least to me.
Scitsonga,
It should be noted first of all that the "sword" Jesus refers to is the word of God. Christians are forbidden from using violence for a Christian purpose. The sword is always referring to the Word of God in the New Testament. This starkly contrasts the Quran, where Muhammad used a real sword to chase, rob, and kill his enemies. Jesus said those who live by the sword (real sword) would die by the sword, and commanded Peter not to use it.
You said,
""He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me." To me this is rather disturbing, makes me think of someone with a personality disorder- megalomania. "
And you are right about one thing, if this was a person then it would be a personality disorder, but we are talking about God here, the comparison is invalid. But you do not have a problem with this, many people put ideals above human relationships, and sacrifice their human relationships for the betterment of humanity. If this applies for the betterment of humanity, then why not for both that and the rightful worship of God, the Creator and Sustainer of the Universe?
"With all the bashing of islam and the quran by christians, it seems christians ignore the cruelties and violence expressed in their bible. You propose Islam be banned, perhaps that should apply to christianity as well. Without these religions, the world might very well be a much better place."
I do not mean to be mean here, but these words show a deep ignorance of what Christianity says. Christianity condemns violence, not one follower of Christ killed a single person for the faith, and when Peter attacked someone, Christ condemned it. Muhammad and the Quran endorsed wide spread killing and pillaging. I have no problem with biblical criticism, but please criticize the Bible, and not your fabrication.
sam123 "Jesus always stood for peace and love."
This doesn't sound like peace to me:
According to Matthew 10, 34-35, jesus stated:
"Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household. He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it."
the part of this: "He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me." To me this is rather disturbing, makes me think of someone with a personality disorder- megalomania.
With all the bashing of islam and the quran by christians, it seems christians ignore the cruelties and violence expressed in their bible. You propose Islam be banned, perhaps that should apply to christianity as well. Without these religions, the world might very well be a much better place.
Islam should be banned!!!!
Its a dangerous religion..instigating death and violence...
Jesus always stood for peace and love..How I wished these muslims opened their eyes to our beautiful gospel!
Here is the movie link, watch it and read my comments. Please correct me if I’m wrong in anything.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGw6rsQ8xHk
Fitna: in case you missed it. There are some disturbing images.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3369102968312745410
Mark 16:15-16, this is only backs up our Lords statement: (I’m paraphrasing here) “I am the way the truth and the life no one come to the Father except through me”, “all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God” and “the wages of sin is death, eternal separation from God our Heavenly Father” And the filmmakers point is…?
What happen at Srebrenica on 11/7/95? 8,000 men and boys died in Bosnian. Correct me if I’m wrong but is this not a former Atheist Soviet bloc? How are Christians responsible?
Mathew 10:34, this is true but here is referring to one loving some family members more than our Lord. This only backs up His statement that we should love Him above all others and things in this world.
Revelation 3:19, this backs our Lords statement that our Heavenly Father will only discipline who He loves, His children. He will not discipline who are not His children (and I want to be disciplined to prefection in Christ Jesus). Spear the rod, spoil the child. The Lord doesn’t want us to be spoiled. Again, and the filmmakers point is…?
Then it showed a cult leader from Jonestown killing his member. Uuuummmmm ….ok, that was a bad thing but, again?
He said not to be offended by this movie because this took things out of context. In the movie Fitna, there are many Muslim preachers saying that they should hate the Jews and cut off their heads. Also, that Islam was once the only religion. It has been around since 800 AD. Christianity is 800 years older and based from the Jewish Torah which has what, 5,000 years?
The film maker stated that he made it in 12 hours and that Fitna was made in 3 Months. I’m guessing that Fitna did more research. Also, he said that there is only one God. This is true but I get the feeling that he was trying to point out that we all believe in the same God. The path to hell is wide but the path to Heaven is narrow. Be very careful and wise in your choosing, for there is but only one true Living God, The Lord God Almighty.
Tit for tat...
I'm wondering if these film-makers will include this work on their resumes.....
However, al-Saeed said his movie, entitled "Schism," was not directed against Christians....
not at Christians but any religion that names the name of Christ, believes in the death, burial, resurrection of Christ, deity/humanity of Christ and his sacrifice for sins,his call to repentance of sins and of faith toward god........if Christianity just happens to fit that shoe it was un-intentional...
Sorry, that was supposed to be "a Muslim who converted to Christianity" my mistake.
Here is a message for this Saudi blogger, who thinks he has done something,
Fitna, as controversial as it was, took a wide selection of verses from the Quran, and supported it with massive demonstrations of such violence and hatred. What you have most likely done, is taken verses from the Old Testament, pulled them out of context, and then showed some false Christians who were going against the message of Christianity. Let me ask you, how many death threats did you receive from Christians? How many world wide protests, with massive demonstrations for your death?
Let us look at your country. Christianity is illegal, and conversion from Islam is a punishable offense. You sentence raped women to 200 lashes, and your government and citizens regularly torture Christians. I am sorry, your case is terrible and distasteful, here is a better idea. Instead of making a feeble attempt at forcing a violent interpretation of Christianity (virtually impossible, Christ condemned violence) why don't you prove Fitna wrong by showing how peaceful Islam is in real life.
Here is a test for you, first, go around any predominately Christian country and say, "I was a Christian who converted to Islam" and see how many death threats and violent attacks you receive. Then go through the streets of almost any predominately Islamic country and say, "I was a Muslim who converted to Islam" and see how long you live (I give you a week).
It is a sad joke to try to make Christianity and Islam equivalent in matters of morality.