Sunday, November 08, 2009 Last Update:11:25 am ET

Church|Tue, May. 13 2008 03:23 PM EDT

Joel Osteen Maintains Homosexuality as Sin

By Lillian Kwon|Christian Post Reporter

Jay Bakker, a big supporter of a pro-gay group, met privately with Joel Osteen of Lakewood Church to talk about faith and sexuality issues and to ultimately gain the support of the megapastor.

Son of Jim and Tammy Faye Bakker, Jay and a group of gays and lesbians attended one of Lakewood Church's Sunday worship services in an effort to change the influential pastor's view on gays and lesbians. At the end, Osteen did not affirm homosexuality.

It was the first of six megachurch stops in a pro-gay campaign called The American Family Outing – a collaboration between Soulforce, COLAGE, National Black Justice Coalition, and the Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches. Some 30 LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender) persons and supporters took their national campaign to the country's largest church on Mother's Day to create dialogue around LGBT issues with members of the megachurch.

"Families come in all forms," said Kim Beggs, a lesbian mother and also an Osteen fan, according to the Houston Chronicle. "God loves us."

The group of 30 met with Osteen after service as the megapastor was greeting hundreds of visitors. The Osteens – including the pastor's mother, Dodie, and wife, Victoria – welcomed Bakker and the guests from Soulforce, according to Lakewood spokesman Donald Iloff, who added that the church does not turn visitors away.

Joel Osteen, his brother, Paul, and Iloff then met privately with Bakker and there they discussed faith, family and LGBT people.

"It was a very cordial, very nice meeting," Iloff told The Christian Post on Tuesday. "But ultimately through our conversations, we continued to disagree with Soulforce and Jay's position."

Iloff says Bakker, whose mother is somewhat of a legend in the LGBT community, and the groups involved in the pro-gay campaign want the megachurches not to see homosexuality as sin.

Although Osteen and leaders at Lakewood open their doors to all visitors, Iloff says they "believe homosexuality is sin" and that "it is disobedience under God."

He further affirmed that they will maintain that position.

Osteen, who authored bestselling book Your Best Life Now, had remained largely mum about the issue of homosexuality but indicated in public interviews that he doesn't agree with it.

"I will say we don't see homosexuality as the worst sin," Iloff commented. "Sin is sin."

Churches continue to struggle with the issue of homosexuality especially at a time when many view the church as judgmental and anti-gay. More Christians are urging churches to show compassion while not compromising what they hold as truth.

"As biblically orthodox Christians respond to issues surrounding homosexuality, and more importantly to those affected by this difficult struggle, we must always hold these two points in balance and in complement – the inerrant truth of God's word regarding sexual behavior and the compassionate grace of our Lord Jesus toward those living outside of it," said Melissa Fryrear, director of the gender issues department at Focus on the Family, according to CitizenLink.

Before Sunday's meeting, Osteen turned down Bakker's invitation to attend a picnic with LGBT families on Saturday, partly because he was in preparation for his Sunday sermon, according to Iloff.

But Iloff had also expressed reservations about meeting with Bakker and the gay community, saying that Soulforce wants to use Lakewood Church to "further their agenda," he told the Houston Chronicle.

"If we met to talk, would this group be satisfied if we agreed to disagree?" he posed before the private meeting was held.

Participants of the six-week American Family Outing campaign will continue their efforts with five other megachurches. Willow Creek Community Church in Illinois, The Potter's House in Dallas and Hope Christian Church in Maryland have already agreed to meet with LGBT families, according to Soulforce. The campaign is also targeting Saddleback Community Church in southern California.

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  • Mon May 25, 2009 5:25 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    â

  • Mon May 25, 2009 5:23 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    At what point do we define traditions/church rules/laws/doctrines/elaborations as Sins? The question is important because we know many examples of Clergy/ Religious Leaders confusing social norms and interpreting/elaborating/embellishing the Words of God and Christ out of context, converting church doctrine(s) into Sin, excommunicating and even murdering under the premise of heresy. Examples include: â

  • Mon May 25, 2009 5:22 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    At what point do we define traditions/church rules/laws/doctrines/elaborations as Sins? The question is important because we know many examples of Clergy/ Religious Leaders confusing social norms and interpreting/elaborating/embellishing the Words of God and Christ out of context, converting church doctrine(s) into Sin, excommunicating and even murdering under the premise of heresy. Examples include: â

  • Wed Apr 01, 2009 8:02 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 8

    "I am a gay man (to shorten the explanation) and I am a christian."

    Only in your twisted mind buddy. Read the bible before you make idiotic statements like this.

  • Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:37 pm Agree: 9   Disagree: 5

    I am a new Christian and attend a wonderful church. My pastor preaches about accepting all walks of life and how God loves us all. I believe God does loves us all including sinners. No one is free from sin although we try not to sin. We cannot justify our sins just because we continue to sin. The Bible is clear about homosexuality and those who practice it. Those who do not get a chance to repent will not inherit the Kingdom of God. It really cannot be any clearer. God Bless!!!

  • Mon Mar 02, 2009 2:53 am Agree: 4   Disagree: 4

    Reading the often hateful and cynical comments toward those who preach or minister to others is familiar, as I once was one of those folks. I didn't go thru a conversion but I now see the common thread woven into the holy garments of every single non-hateful church. What I saw in Osteen's response to Larry King was a man who understands that no one church has a patent or exclusive on salvation. To insist otherwise is just plain arrogance, and shows a supreme ignorance of other paths to our God that so far you simply haven't been thoroughly exposed. Learn more, ask questions before providing your canned answers.

    Pride, Hubris, Ego, Dogma. All are merely words for selfishness and describe the largely narcissistic attitude that, "I'm right so I get to go to heaven, but you're wrong, so you're not." What kind of uninformed, isolated fool honestly still believes that they have been so blessed by either pure dumb-luck to have been born into; or circumstances to have been surrounded by; or mere fate to have blithely stumbled upon, "the only right way to salvation" - everyone else be damned. What small minded baboons still believe that there is only one way? Can't you see how each sect even within "your way" amended its beliefs to appease the constituency of it's time or leaders - or are you simply ignorant of its severe changes? Does it make you feel stronger, more powerful, more entitled or superior to feel your way to be the only way??? My guess is yes, probably, and there's mountains of psychological and sociological evidence to support this phenomena - otherwise you'd have to share "the way" with another message, messenger, or form of greatness, and that would rock your smallness to its core (or the priests/kings who made the rules you blindly accept). Saying aloud, "I don't know for certain... but I have strong intuitions and beliefs" makes you stronger, not weaker - and it certainly makes you a more loving individual.


    C'mon folks. Get out of your rut - get over yourselves and your prejudices. Read more from sources and thinkers outside your current dogma. Not doing so is Slothful, Prideful, and Not even loving of your neighbor... and it's just plain foolish. You may, in fact, be reinforced in your previously held views... but I highly doubt it. Expanding our little brains is a one-way trip, we will never return to exactly the same small town from which we departed but rather, we become acquainted with a grandness and mystery that we always knew was larger and more amazing that even those who came before us had been able to see.

  • Mon Mar 02, 2009 2:51 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 3

    Reading the often hateful and cynical comments toward those who preach or minister to others is familiar, as I once was one of those folks. I didn't go thru a conversion but I now see the common thread woven into the holy garments of every single non-hateful church. What I saw in Osteen's response to Larry King was a man who understands that no one church has a patent or exclusive on salvation. To insist otherwise is just plain arrogance, and shows a supreme ignorance of other paths to our God that so far you simply haven't been thoroughly exposed. Learn more, ask questions before providing your canned answers.

    Pride, Hubris, Ego, Dogma. All are merely words for selfishness and describe the largely narcissistic attitude that, "I'm right so I get to go to heaven, but you're wrong, so you're not." What kind of uninformed, isolated fool honestly still believes that they have been so blessed by either pure dumb-luck to have been born into; or circumstances to have been surrounded by; or mere fate to have blithely stumbled upon, "the only right way to salvation" - everyone else be damned. What small minded baboons still believe that there is only one way? Can't you see how each sect even within "your way" amended its beliefs to appease the constituency of it's time or leaders - or are you simply ignorant of its severe changes? Does it make you feel stronger, more powerful, more entitled or superior to feel your way to be the only way??? My guess is yes, probably, and there's mountains of psychological and sociological evidence to support this phenomena - otherwise you'd have to share "the way" with another message, messenger, or form of greatness, and that would rock your smallness to its core (or the priests/kings who made the rules you blindly accept). Saying aloud, "I don't know for certain... but I have strong intuitions and beliefs" makes you stronger, not weaker - and it certainly makes you a more loving individual.

    If you want to see something which will not only build, reinforce, and justify your faith (no matter its source) watch the 12-hr series, "The Power of Myth" by wise sage and scholar to many a minister and professor, Joseph Campbell. You will realize what your intuitions have been telling you all along - that the duality, the duplicity, the metaphoric symbolism of the simultaneously beautiful and horrific (make God angry and he floods the earth kids and all) allegorical Bible tales, create a truthful-hypocrisy (love your enemy, but turn to salt for looking upon God??) which can split into 200+ sects within 2000 yrs of the Christian story alone.

  • Sun Feb 22, 2009 10:19 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    I'm so sorry! Quick correction to my post below: Second sentence I meant to write "he has decided to NOT practice the lifestyle". Sorry again...

  • Sun Feb 22, 2009 10:17 am Agree: 4   Disagree: 2

    I have a very good friend who is a gay Christian. Though, he has studied both sides of the argument and has not been able to find Biblical truth to support the gay lifestyle. So he has decided to practice the lifestyle. I also have a good friend who is dating a man who's heart has changed away from the lifestyle - proving that God can change hearts! I love people of all walks of life and would continue a relationship with my friend no matter what decision he makes... Though, I am happy to hear he is sees the truth as presented in the Bible. Joel is right when he says 'sin is sin'. My ex-boyfriend - who is not gay - struggles with sexual sin where it almost consumes him! Therefore, he is no different from another person struggling with homosexuality. I think because people see themselves as truly good people, with good hearts they find it hard to believe something that feels natural is sinful. Same for my ex - he is one of the best people that I have met, but yet he struggles with such great sin. Every gay person that I have met have been some of the greatest people that I have encountered and I believe God loves every single one! But we also have to remember we ALL were born with a sinful nature - therefore we all have our struggles in life... No matter how pure our hearts may be - Satan attacks and deceives us all. So may God Bless ALL people and may we all find the truth as presented in Scripture. And remember, facing the truth of sin is NEVER an easy thing.

  • Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:43 am Agree: 7   Disagree: 15

    I find it interesting that the people that are adamant about homosexuality being a sin are heterosexuals. How dare Joel Olsteen and his church put out statements condemning homosexuality as a sin. How irresponnsible of him as a leader in the church. How many lives will be lost to suicide because of his obstinance to see homosexuality as a viable sexual orientation. It is sad that the church separates groups instead of bringing them together. Jay Baker is a humanitarian along the lines of Mother Theresa. I truly believe this. I don't agree with Christianity, but I find it enlightening that a man can see past the views of his organized religion. Joel Olsteen and his group are truly wolves in sheeps clothing. I used to like him and his positive message. I find it hard to agree with a man that exludes a group of people based on their idea of love.

  • Thu Jan 29, 2009 10:38 am Agree: 12   Disagree: 3

    PS: This is nothing new, this isn't some new revolutionary movement happening, this isn't America changing and evolving to a higher level of "love". Read your ENTIRE bible, it's all in there. God said this would happen in the last days, people coming into the churches, people twisting His word, people starting up "new" types of "christianity",,etc. etc. etc.....the only good and exciting thing about the gay christian movement is it tells me the end is near and we're about to be outta here!!!!

  • Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:09 pm Agree: 29   Disagree: 8

    I got so sick of this discussion. I am a gay man (to shorten the explanation) and I am a christian. I've followed the socalled gay christian movement with great offense. I've seen all the arguements, blah. If you want to be a christian, follow the book and do not try to rewrite it. If you don't like it, go talk to Buddha (ya never see anyone trying to rewrite his book) Homosexuality is a sin, so I try my absolute best to live my life celibate. I've tried everything I can (believe me) to not be gay. Unless God delivers me I will remain this way,,,but celibate. And I do believe it is a sin. By the way, so is sodomy, even in a straight marriage. Jesus does love the homosexual, but He will love you all the way to hell, also. Everyone is trying to make christianity work for them without changing anything about themselves, only the book, find another religion for gosh sakes. What am I giving up? A life without sex, in exchange for eternity with Jesus, works for me. You know what the most ironic part is? The world itself (the gay community) proved to me it doesn't work, God or no God. I get repulsed at the gay couples fighting for marriage, its mostly always middle aged people that have known each other a few months(I saw where the very first lesbian couple married got a divorce shortly thereafter). Please know these gay people do NOT speak for all gay people. God has touched my life in many ways, so I will believe His word and not try to change it, but try my best to live by it and I believe thats what we are all required to do, its a matter of your heart, because we will all sin daily, your heart determines what you believe is truth, and if your repentive about the sin in your life. Thanks.
    ps. Its great to see the largest church in America stand up to the gay loud mouths and stand Gods ground, and not try to be politically and socially correct!

  • Sun Jan 25, 2009 9:54 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    Good for Osteen, as it's what God says it is and 'not the world'. No matter what the world 'thinks or says', people are not born gay because God does not make mistakes (perhaps it has to do more with demonic spirits invading the body and causing one to become gay than anything else, but that doesn't mean that the Lord can't deliver those who wish to come out of the homosexual lifestyle.). Now that Joel has tackled this issue, I'll be praying for Jay and those take on this stance, hopefully and prayerfully he will respond to the issue of why he does not speak on "sin and repentance" at his center? I have heard him say that those who attends his center are 'already' saved (but I've often wondered what would happened if 'non-christians' started slipping in, and they haven't heard the good news of the Gospel?), but can you be certain that's true? Does anyone here attend Joel's church, and have you ever heard him speak on 'sin and repentance', or even opened his Bible and taught about the Word of God and Jesus Christ? Not trying to start a debate, just wondering since I've never seen him do it on one of his programs yet. Thanks and God bless.

  • Fri Nov 14, 2008 12:36 am Agree: 12   Disagree: 8

    let the Word of God be the final authority on all things including gay marriage. The Torah is very clear on same sex issues.
    God has not changed His mind nor will he ever. Gay sexual relationships according to the God of The Bible, are an abomination (Lev. 18 & Rom. 1)
    Of course God offers complete deliverance for all who want it, but He will never excuse the sin until one turns from it.
    No matter what excuse anyone makes, it will always be sin, just like lying, cheating, stealing, adultery etc..
    let's get real folks and stop being afraid of people and what they think.
    There is deliverance for all who want it with Christ
    I cannot believe that Jim & Tammi's son would buy into the lie. I met him when he first came back to the Lord in L.A. and he was different then. Lord, open his eyes, help Him to see and know the Truth.

  • Mon Oct 20, 2008 9:14 am Agree: 12   Disagree: 17

    Being a gay woman, I ALMOST got offended and hurt by your judgemental attitude, then I realized you are a man. Human, that is! Only God can judge me!!
    There is NOTHING you can tell me to make me believe that my God doesn't love me and hold me in high regard and highly favors me because I LOVE differently from you. It's like saying you show differences in you OWN children. Who does that?
    There are so many people, gay or not, who is sooo desperate for love and go to church to find some...only to be told "God doesn't hate you the sinner just the sin and please change who you are, I know God created you but something went wrong with you"
    F.Y.I...we don't choose to be gay, we ARE!
    I thank God everyday for blessing me with love and compassion and the ability to love, without judgement. I'm pretty sure there is a space for me in Heaven and my God loves me...How He created Me. Any problems with me...take it up with God and tell him how wrong He is for creating His child in His likeness too. Just like you!

  • Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:56 pm Agree: 14   Disagree: 15

    the bible says that not only is homosexuality a sin, but an abomination. my daughter is living the gay life style and i have showed her what the bible says and she knows the truth but chooses to live that lifestyle anyways. i love her regardless and will support her in any way except for the gay life style i will not support that choice what so ever. all i can do is continue to pray and hope that she soon turns back from her sin and chooses to live with men the way god intended. i dont treat gay people bad, but i dont and wont ever agree or believe that people are born gay. thats balony. alana

  • Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:08 pm Agree: 8   Disagree: 12

    What is really called''sin'' is homosexual bashing.

  • Thu Jul 03, 2008 8:16 pm Agree: 24   Disagree: 10

    First we have to recall that God said homosexual sex is wrong in Lev 18. He repeated this in Romans 1 (that would be where he called it degrading, impurity, dishonoring, unnatural, indecent).

    Romans 3:20 says we are not found righteous by the Law, but it teaches us what sin is.

    Romans 6:23 says we earn death with our sin.

    The Old Testament gives many concrete examples of spiritual truths that are explicitly defined in the New Testament. The basic one of which is that God comes first in your life, then others.

    Let’s say that you feel sexual attraction and even love for someone of the same gender. Let’s further posit that you want to marry this person. How can that be against the spirit of what Christ said were the two greatest laws, to love God and love others as yourself?

    The answer is in Romans 1:19-32. Let me break it down:

    By putting your desires above God's you are putting yourself, a created creature, in the place of God in your life.

    By refusing to accept what God has said about homosexual sex being a sin, you are refusing to honor God.

    By ignoring His word, you are being ungodly, and suppressing the truth.

    By saying that your thoughts on the subject are more important that God's thoughts on it, you are exchanging the truth of God for your own thoughts.

    If you want to sin and ignore God, you are certainly free to do so. God will eventually give you more and more of it, until you reap what you sow. When anything takes the place of God in your life (whether its a TV, a job, a person, yourself, your desires, your fears, money, fame, a carved idol, etc), then you are sinning. If you continue to do so, you are hardening your heart. God will eventually give you over to that sin - He will eventually harden your heart.

    Your sin will eventually move from a personal hidden thing to a public thing, to a thing where you approve of others doing your sin.

    And your sin will cause you to do other unrighteous things.

    Now, this goes against what Christ said were the two greatest commands because if you truly loved God OR yourself, you will love God with all your strength, mind, and spirit. You would be obedient to GOD rather than thinking your thoughts and feelings should take precedence over what God has said.

    But instead, you choose to argue and justify rather than Love and Obey.

    Christ is only the savior for those who trust in His saving work -- and if He is, then they will obey Him, If they do not obey, then that is evidence that He is not their savior.

    Hebrews 5:9,
    And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him

  • Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:04 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 3

    alpick, you are deceived.

  • Sun Jun 15, 2008 7:22 pm Agree: 12   Disagree: 4

    That group professes to be Christians, while maintaining a sexually immoral lifestyle. That being as it is, we are told in 1 Corinthians 5:11 [NIV] that we are not to even eat with such a one. It states: "But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat."

    Therefore, Osteen did the right thing by not meeting with that group.

  • Tue May 27, 2008 3:42 pm Agree: 6   Disagree: 1

    The Just Live by Faith

    16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ,[a] for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. 17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, “The just shall live by faith.”[b]
    God’s Wrath on Unrighteousness

    18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, 21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man—and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.
    24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, 25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.
    26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
    28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality,[c] wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving,[d] unmerciful; 32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

    Footnotes:

    Romans 1:16 NU-Text omits of Christ.
    Romans 1:17 Habakkuk 2:4
    Romans 1:29 NU-Text omits sexual immorality.
    Romans 1:31 NU-Text omits unforgiving.

  • Tue May 27, 2008 1:00 am Agree: 4   Disagree: 18

    First I want to say is HOMOSEXUAL is NOT BY CHOICE, a person is born that way!! I am a homosexual and I am a CHRISTIAN too. Before the man I LOVED died he got saved too. I know he is in HEAVEN and we will be together again when I die and go to Heaven. And to say it is wrong to live together and love each other without being marred, we did too. That is why we was marred. So we was not living in SIN !! I would like you to read from GOD`S words the BIBLE LUKE :17 ; 34 - 36 Then tell me what you think !!

  • Mon May 19, 2008 8:07 pm Agree: 9   Disagree: 2

    Any sex outside of marriage is a Mortal sin. What you do in the flesh severely affects your soul. A mortal sin is a sin like Paul says that brings death.

    If you want life and everlasting life, than accept Jesus' death on the Cross for your sins, repent and do not sin like that again.

  • Mon May 19, 2008 12:26 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    ASMatthew

    What is your Biblical basis for this statement?

    "God loves a sinner but hates sin."

  • Sat May 17, 2008 4:41 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 0

    "I will say we don't see homosexuality as the worst sin," Iloff commented. "Sin is sin."

    Very interesting. It is good to know that Osteen hasn't completely sold out to the spirit of this age.

  • Sat May 17, 2008 1:06 pm Agree: 7   Disagree: 1

    God loves a sinner but hates sin. God loves a bank robber, and if the bank robbers of
    of a community likes to have equal rights in a Church due to their sheer strength or
    persistence to reach parity with the rest of the people, there the real question of "truth"
    will be faced with!. The word of God can't be changed, and if we fail to uphold the
    eternal truths of the Bible, we will be judged by the judgement of God written very plainly in
    the Bible. It is very dangerous to play with the word of God because it is sharper than
    any double-edged sword. I have heard sermons years back from the pulpits about women
    wearing pants, and I felt pity on those preachers because they were barking at the wrong
    subject due to ignorance. But it is time for the men of God to stand firm with the word of
    God and clearly stand for the commandments of God, because man can't change God's
    laws. Time or majority opinion can't change God's laws.

  • Fri May 16, 2008 1:24 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 5

    I consider the Gay movement another de humanizing brick is the modernest wall of speration from the garden.

  • Fri May 16, 2008 1:20 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 2

    I love this guy, and I think his position is doctrinally correct and shows spin.

  • Thu May 15, 2008 12:53 pm Agree: 5   Disagree: 5

    I'm amazed that he had the courage to do it. Will he stand by his convictions when his membership starts declining because of his view?


    No he won't.

  • Wed May 14, 2008 11:51 pm Agree: 15   Disagree: 3

    Weshlovercm: I agree, I believe the love of Christ must be given to all. Whether homosexual, drunk, idolater, reviler, and any form of sinful nature. As Romans 3:23 tells us, "For all have sinned and fallen short to the glory of God." However, you made mentioned that you are a gay Christian and that you and "many others" believe that "homophobia" is a sin. Yet, "homophobia" is not a "sin" mentioned in the Bible. Therefore, it is not a sin but a preference. I do not agree with being homophobic, but "homophobia" is not a sin mentioned in the Bible. Let us be careful with not making our "preferences" into doctrines. You sound like you are trying to defend homosexuality. If homosexuality was indeed not a sin, than one would not need to defend it. However, because it is a choice one chooses to live by, than he/she will defend their preference. I do not have a hate nor a phobia for anyone in the homosexual community, however, one who claims Christianity must than take God's Word as authority and not try to make their preferences into doctrines. Therefore, if you are a Christian who has trusted Jesus as Lord and Savior, than your faith came by hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17). Thus, if the Word of God is what brought you to a relationship with God, than God has also in His Word made it perfectly plain what He feels about all sin, including homosexuality.

  • Wed May 14, 2008 10:52 pm Agree: 6   Disagree: 16

    megapastors keep themselves well insulated from without, no one is allowed to penetrate that invisible wall. plus like the catholic church, their size dictates that there be little or no major changes in public stated beliefs, because of the possibility of alienation or disaffection which ultimately will effect the bottomline. theology by economics and political necessity


    and people wonder why church attendance has diminished?

  • Wed May 14, 2008 7:21 pm Agree: 8   Disagree: 3

    1 corinthians 6:9 tells us what will not be accepted in the Kingdom of Heaven! I pray for all that obey the Word God has given us and all who need His Word in their lives. I feel it is our stewardship that will set the example and our gracious Father in Heaven will be the Judge for those who chose to disobey His Word.

  • ML »
    Wed May 14, 2008 6:33 pm Agree: 24   Disagree: 3

    Good for Joel. The Bible teaches that homosexuality is a sin, and clearly teaches it. There is no room for compromise. The church did the right thing in welcoming all visitors, and also to talk with them after the service. We all have our struggles with sin, and we should admit our struggles. But for people like Jay Bakker, to promote and campaign for homosexuality, they are not admitting struggle, but approving of their sin ! Pray for Jay, that he will repent of his sinful agenda, and pray for all megachurches to welcome the sinners but reject the sins of our day.

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