Updated 12:47 pm.EST, Sun November 22, 2009

Society|Sat, Jun. 07 2008 11:12 AM EDT

Obama Could Win 40 Percent of Evangelical Vote, Says Expert

By Jennifer Riley|Christian Post Reporter

A well-connected authority in the evangelical world said in an interview this week that Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama could get up to 40 percent of the evangelical vote.

  • Obama
    (Photo: AP Images / Alex Brandon)
    Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Barack Obama D-Ill., jogs onto the stage at a Chicago 2016 Olympic rally at Daley Plaza in Chicago on Friday, June 6, 2008.

The fascination with the charismatic Illinois senator combined with evangelicals’ effort to not be seen as an appendage of the Republican Party could swing evangelical voters in Obama’s favor, predicted Mark DeMoss – a prominent public relations executive whose clients include Focus on the Family, Franklin Graham, and Campus Crusade for Christ – to Beliefnet.com.

“I will not be surprised if he gets one third of the evangelical vote,” DeMoss said in the interview. “I wouldn’t be surprised if it was 40 percent.”

For comparison, the public relations guru pointed out that one-third of white evangelicals had voted for former president Bill Clinton in his 1996 re-election bid during the “height of [the] Monica Lewinsky mess.”

“That’s a statistic I didn’t believe at first but I double and triple checked it,” he said, “I would not be surprised if that many or more voted for Barack Obama in this election.”

In terms of Republican presidential nominee John McCain, DeMoss spoke about the lack of enthusiasm within the evangelical circle for the candidate. He said that for months now he hasn’t received an e-mail, letter, or phone call from fellow evangelicals urging that they unite behind McCain and “put aside whatever differences we have.”

“It’s just very quiet. It could mean there’s a real sense of apathy or it could mean they’re waiting for the general election to begin,” he said. “But it’s a surprise, given the way e-mail networks work now.”

On McCain’s part, he hasn’t done much to reach out to DeMoss either. DeMoss said he has received one phone call from a McCain staffer about a month ago asking if he would like to help campaign for McCain. But the evangelical leader, who had enthusiastically campaigned for former presidential candidate Mitt Romney, turned down the invitation.

“I told him that I’m a conservative first and a Republican second,” he said. “I was inclined to vote for Senator McCain but not to get involved beyond that.”

DeMoss briefly mentioned the 2000 incident when McCain lashed out at his former boss, Jerry Falwell, and Pat Robertson. He later commented that McCain’s recent rejection of the endorsements of Pastors John Hagee and Rod Parsley was a “mistake.”

Although the two pastors have some controversial views on theology, both, in terms of values, support what many evangelicals hold dear, DeMoss contends.

“Here were two conservative religious pastors who were probably out on a limb supporting him,” he said. “And he responds to criticism over comments they made and rejects them. That was a slap in the face to evangelicals who are already somewhat suspect of Senator McCain.”

But whatever happens in this election, one thing DeMoss wants to make clear is evangelicals are not “absolutely Republican.”

“Polls don’t show that to be true,” he said.

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  • Mon Oct 13, 2008 3:25 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    *** People of faith are voting McCain - Palin ***

    Some facts on Obama's voting and speaking against the teaching of Christ:

    - Obama votes to kill babies born alive. These are people Jesus loves.

    - Obama calls traditional marriage, which Jesus ordained, "divisive".

    - Biden's church has told Biden not to take communion.

    Let's vote for McCain - Palin beacuse they care for all babies and marriage - instead of voting because someone is black or speaks well.

  • Fri Oct 10, 2008 4:08 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Please Obama set in Rev. Wright church for 20 years and he has listen to his bad talk for 20 years. Now, Obama is trying to get away from Rev. Wright when he had 20 years to do so. I want a President that loves and defend the house of the Lord everyday not just when voter complain.

    Obama set in the church of Rev. Wright for over twenty years. He only left that church when the public complained. Now, the Rev. Wright talked about hating whites, Jews, America and anything not black. Now, Rev. Wright is a man of GOD so he says.
    When, the pastor preached to hate whites, Obama set there even when he knew that disrespected his white mother and grandparents who loved and raised him. His father did not do that.
    When, the pastor preached to hate America, Obama as a public official of USA and swore to defend it set as the hate America was strewn.
    When, the pastor preached hate he disrespected the house of the Lord. Church is for worship of GOD not to preach hate. How, dare Obama set there and listen to the hate in a church. The Rev. was supposed to be a man of GOD and GOD is love. You should never use the house of GOD to spew hate. I totally do not like OBAMA because he disrespects GOD by letting hate enter into his house.
    His views on the economy and world view is scary but, his lack of respect for the Lord is bad.
    I am mixed as Obama and attend a black church. Blacks love GOD and I am offended that it makes it look as though black use the house of GOD to preach hate. This is only Rev. Wrights church and his parishioner.

  • JHS »
    Mon Jul 07, 2008 6:06 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "DeMoss briefly mentioned the 2000 incident when McCain lashed out at his former boss, Jerry Falwell, and Pat Robertson. He later commented that McCain’s recent rejection of the endorsements of Pastors John Hagee and Rod Parsley was a “mistake.”



    THERE IS SO MUCH IN THIS ARTICLE!! The fact that McCain dumped the endorsementS from the millionaire tele evangelist is a problem for DeMoss, speak volumes about the disconnect between the average person and the right wing evangelical republican crowd. Here's some advice......WAKE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Fri Jun 13, 2008 7:26 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    Did Obama ever explain why he became a christian?

    that is, why he denies/d mohammed and allah?

    If not, than he is a muslim…as much as he likes us to think otherwise…

    I wonder what those preachers asked him when they met…i really wonder how they could meet obama and not seek his testimony…

  • Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:19 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 2

    For those of you Christians who are still naive enough to vote for a liberal Democrat, this just came in hot off the press:

    Canadian Pastor Fined after Speaking Against Homosexuality

    Human-rights tribunal also orders him to stop sharing his Bible-based beliefs.

    A Canadian human-rights tribunal has ordered a Christian pastor to renounce his faith and never again express moral opposition to homosexuality, WorldNetDaily reported.

    The Alberta Human Rights Tribunal ordered the Rev. Stephen Boissoin to stop expressing his biblical perspective of homosexuality and to pay $7,000 in "damages for pain and suffering."

    The decision came after Boissoin wrote a letter to the editor of his local Red Deer, Alberta, newspaper in 2002 that included this statement: "Children as young as five and six years of age are being subjected to psychologically and physiologically damaging pro-homosexual literature and guidance in the public school system; all under the fraudulent guise of equal rights."

    http://www.citizenlink.org/CLNews/A000007622.cfm

  • igh »
    Thu Jun 12, 2008 8:29 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 3

    Obama has Faith. It is put in the wrong places for sure. He does Trust in himself and his Agendas. He Loves himself but despises God. He has no Trust in God and does the works of Satan. He refuses to submit to Christ Jesus but will sign legislation on murder of children. He submits to the lusts of satan. There is not change of heart toward God and Repentance of sin, He Justifies sins of Gays and Lesbians. Truely an self professed anti-christ. He is against God , and enemy of God.

    Jas 4:1 From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
    Jas 4:2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
    Jas 4:3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
    Jas 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
    Jas 4:5 Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?
    Jas 4:6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.
    Jas 4:7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
    Jas 4:8 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded.
    Jas 4:9 Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness.
    Jas 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.
    Jas 4:11 Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.
    Jas 4:12 There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?
    Jas 4:13 Go to now, ye that say, To day or to morrow we will go into such a city, and continue there a year, and buy and sell, and get gain:
    Jas 4:14 Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away.
    Jas 4:15 For that ye ought to say, If the Lord will, we shall live, and do this, or that.
    Jas 4:16 But now ye rejoice in your boastings: all such rejoicing is evil.
    Jas 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

  • Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:24 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

    Last year, presidential candidate Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., made a promise to the Planned Parenthood Action Fund:

    "The first thing I'd do as president is sign the Freedom of Choice Act," he said.

    The so-called Freedom of Choice Act could wipe away every state law limiting abortion, undoing decades of legal work, research and educational successes.

    Obama has co-sponsored the legislation with 18 other senators. The bill has the support of 109 members of Congress.

    Excerpt from:
    http://www.citizenlink.org/CLtopstories/A000007601.cfm

  • Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:40 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 2

    Obama reveals knew from the getgo what the Rev. Jeremiah Wright was all about and ... he join TUCC anyways and ... remained a member for over twenty years. Obama outright lied to the the American people when he implied otherwise.

    Janet

    ++++++++

    Obama 'Appalled' By Ex-Pastor's Comments
    Wright's Comments A 'Show Of Disrespect To Me'
    UPDATED: 5:24 pm EDT April 29, 2008

    Calling the Rev. Jeremiah Wright "not the same person I met 20 years ago," Sen. Barack Obama said Tuesday he was "appalled" by his former pastor's comments Monday at the National Press Club.

    http://www.nbc10.com/politics/16060061/detail.html


    Audacity of Barack Obama and Rev. Wright
    March 18, 2008 01:00 PM EST

    In Senator Obama's first book, titled Dreams of My Father and published in 1995 (after he had been elected president of the Harvard Law Review but before he had been elected to public office), Senator Obama wrote at length about Rev. Wright and his moving "Audacity of Hope" speech.

    In Dreams, Senator Obama explained how he met Rev. Wright[, whom he mentioned had been "dabbling with liquor, Islam, and black nationalism in the sixties."

    He acknowledged that Rev. Wright immediately had given him fair warning that he was controversial, by quoting Rev. Wright as having said: "Some of my fellow clergy don't appreciate what we're about. They feel like we're too radical. Others, we aren't radical enough. Too emotional. Not emotional enough."

    He also acknowledged that Rev. Wright let him know at their first meeting that he looked unfavorably on America and expected to continue to do so, by stating, "Life's not safe for a black man in this country, Barack. Never has been. Probably never will be."

    Senator Obama left with one of Rev. Wright's "Black Value System" brochures.

    When Senator Barack listened to Rev. Wright's "Audacity of Hope" sermon, September 11, 2001 was years away, but, Senator Obama admitted in Dreams, Rev. Wright castigated America ...

    More:
    http://www.theconservativevoice.com/article/

  • Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:31 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    THE FOUNDATION OF TRINITY UNITED CHURCH OF CHRIST (TUCC) - BARACK OBAMA'S CHURCH FOR THE PAST TWENTY YEARS

    ... "The vision statement of Trinity United Church of Christ is based upon the systematized liberation theology that started in 1969 with the publication of Dr. James Cone’s book, Black Power and Black Theology."

    http://www.tucc.org/talking_points.htm

    ++++++++++++++

    The Marxist Roots of Black Liberation Theology
    April 2, 2008

    While Black Liberation Theology is not main stream in most black churches, many pastors in Wright's generation are burdened by (James) Cone's categories which laid the foundation for many to embrace Marxism and a distorted self-image of the perpetual "victim."

    ... In FOR MY PEOPLE, Cone explains that "the Christian faith does not possess in its nature the means for analyzing the structure of capitalism. Marxism as a tool of social analysis can disclose the gap between appearance and reality, and thereby help Christians to see how things really are."

    More:
    http://www.acton.org/commentary/443_marxist_roots_of_black_liberation_theology.php

    +++++++

    Black Theology & Black Power (Paperback)

    First published in 1969, "Black Theology & Black Power" provided the first systematic presentation of black theology. Relating the militant struggle for liberation with the gospel message of salvation, James Cone laid the foundation for an original interpretation of Christianity that retains its urgency and challenge today.

    http://www.amazon.ca/Black-Theology-Power-J-Cone/dp/1570751579

    +++++++++

    QUOTES - "BLACK POWER & BLACK THEOLOGY"

    "Christ is black therefore not because of some cultural or psychological need of black people, but because and only because Christ really enters into our world where the poor were despised and the black are, disclosing that he is with them enduring humiliation and pain and transforming oppressed slaves into liberating servants." James Cone

    "Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against white people, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him. The task of black theology is to kill Gods who do not belong to the black community ... Black theology will accept only the love of God which participates in the destruction of the white enemy. What we need is the divine love as expressed in Black Power, which is the power of black people to destroy their oppressors here and now by any means at their disposal. Unless God is participating in this holy activity, we must reject his love." James Cone

    "In the New Testament, Jesus is not for all, but for the oppressed, the poor and unwanted of society, and against oppressors ... Either God is for black people in their fight for liberation and against the white oppressors, or he is not." James Cone

    ++++++++++

  • Tue Jun 10, 2008 5:04 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 4

    justme984Mon Jun 09, 2008 3:44 pm

    Besides after the last two stolen elections by the GOP does it really matter.

    Just can't get over the due process can you people. But don't worry, Al Core has made his millions, more that he would have made as POTUS, with his lies about global warming. Remember his big carbon foot print from his big house and private jet travel, now that's you should be complaining about.
    Remember the world keeps changing every day and it has been taking care of it self for many many years.
    Have a great day.

  • Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:56 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    I guess I'll be one of the racist they are talking about since I'll not be voting for Obama. I'll be voting for the RINO. Not the best but better than Hillary (thanks for dropping out) or Obama who I see as waaay to far left for me. I'm already hoarding dry goods so I can eat after he raises my taxes. He wants to raise my taxes to GIVE to people and nations that didn't earn it. If he gets elected, we'll serve him just like we did FDR and J. Carter.
    Enjoy your days of freedom as long as you can.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 6:13 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Newt How can you say He is NOT for gay marriage" , and " his web page specifically says he supports civil unions" when they are both the same? Its just 2 different ways of saying the same thing. Its like saying a "spade" is not black, would you be talking about the gardening implement? or the playing card. Their both spades, but totally different kind of spades. The Bible does tell us to love all peoples, as Jesus and the Father do, but that does not mean to be in agreement with them. There is a chuch that has as part of its name Metro, and it supports so called Gays, trouble is, for those that wish to say the Bible supports them, in ( Ro 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. ) KJV or (Ro 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. ) Living or ( Ro 7:2 - For example, a married woman is bound by Torah to her husband while he is alive; but if the husband dies, she is released from the part of the Torah that deals with husbands. ) if your Jewish. If were going to call ourselves Evangevicals or what ever form of Christian or Masianic Jew, what ever form of church they come out of, do they use the Bible as their basis, or do they use their own interpretation, because (2Pe 1:20 - knowing this first, that no prophecy of scripture is of private interpretation. ) or by the Jewish Bible (2 Peter 1:20 First of all, understand this: no prophecy of Scripture is to be interpreted by an individual on his own; ) So for those that wish to call themselves by any form or type of Christian, they should consider what the Bible itself says, and let it interpret itself, or not call themselves that, and just say that they are New Age, than they can get away with anything, including Panthiesm. Either they are what they say they are, or, as far as I can tell, Nothing.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:37 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I can clarify: when christianity has been joined with civil power it has always persecuted. The papacy alone is responsible for millions of deaths in the name of God. (foxes book of martyrs for starters). I use the term christianity loosely- true christians would not fall into this catagory! However Religion and civil power should remain separate. Athiests, abortionists, gays are not infringing on my freedom to worship God. My hunble opinion is to NOT legislate morality, God will judge, Matt. 24 clearly states to expect this in the last days-I see nothing there for a call to rally and Win this Country back for God.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:57 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 0

    justme984: you need to give some statistics about the statement.
    It was not "Christianity" that persecuted, but those who misused the name of Christ for their own gain. It is far from any teaching of Christ to implement or require adherence to the faith (then it would not be faith).
    Atheism, which views no eternal man, and its partner, evolution, which views man as just another animal, has bloodier hands for murdering innocents. Think of Stalin, Hitler, Mao. Think of the carnage of abortion and so-called "mercy" killing.
    It was Christians who started orphanages, hospitals, homeless shelters because we view each human life as precious because our Savior sacrificed Himself for each one, even though the vast, vast majority hate Him and what He stands for (that we are sinners who cannot save ourselves).
    I would like to see you support your statement, justme984 with some facts. Even the slaughter of those who misused the name of Christ does not compare with the carnage done by those who claimed to be of other faiths, especially atheism

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:44 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 1

    Just one more thing to my friend steiner: Atheism has no doubt killed alot of people, one only need to look at France during thE, however Christianity when combined with civil power has ALWAYS persecuted and has done much, much more than ANY other power, including Hitler.
    As far as voting being a resposibility to democracy---I do not agree. Our forfathers fought and died for our FREEDOMS, freedom to vote or not to vote. Besides after the last two stolen elections by the GOP does it really matter. The powerful elite always will find a way to secure their agenda. McCain will win-more war, more corporate government takeover, more national debt, more rediculous trade agreements ect........ doesn't sound too Christian to me.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:27 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    I'd like to start out that we as a country are NOT a democracy rather a republic. A nation of laws. Some good some not so good. In ALL man made governments, communism, nazi, fascist, king, "democracies" they all share at least one common thread, POWER OVER PEOPLE. True here too especially after 9/11. This country was founded on some christian principles-primarily FREEDOM to worship God. Our DEIST founders recognized that it is God who gives free choice. Unfortunetly the pendulum has swung too far from our christian heritage, however from the many books I have read on the subject, I fear we will swing it too far the other way and legislate christianity, and morality in an attempt to get this country back to God. This has been prophesied in Rev. 13:11-18. Can there be any doubt the beast rising out of the earth is the U.S.? I think we should have a tolerant attitude toward our brethern across the world, including the millions of killed and displaced INNOCENT people in Iraq, due to the direct actions of our country (bush adminstration and eventually McCains)!

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:12 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    I don't support this man at all, but
    I believe the answer to the question about the quote from Obama is as follows:

    The actual quote from the book "Audacity of Hope" is from page 261 and is as follows: "Of course, not all my conversations in immigrant communities follow this easy pattern. In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly; they need specific reassurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 3:11 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 4

    "...then we should be also supporting the kids that are in gay families."

    I don't support kids in this environment. That's why I faught for my daughter in court when my exwife left me for another woman. I won, and now my daughter gets to live in a sound, moral, Christian home.

  • Newt »
    Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:45 pm Agree: 7   Disagree: 5

    Obama cares for all the things WE care about, including the environment, healthcare and taking care of America and our good name in the world. He is NOT for gay marriage, his web page specifically says he supports civil unions.

    Listen, there's nothing wrong with gay citizens having equal rights. They have kids, they pay taxes, they're American citizens just like us. No matter what you believe about their lifestyle, they are our neighbors and relatives and they deserve to be treated fairly. Did you know that if a gay person owns a house and puts his or her partner on the deed to the property, they have to pay extra taxes on the equity in their home? And if they have kids and one of the parents dies, the kids could be taken away from the other parent? This situation is SO un-American!

    If we truly do support family values, then we should be also supporting the kids that are in gay families. Heck, most of those kids are heterosexual, right?

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:44 pm Agree: 8   Disagree: 7

    I DON'T CARE IF MCCAIN REJECTS ALL EVANGELICAL LEADERS, I AM NOT VOTING FOR ANYONE WHO WANTS TO PROMOTE THE KILLING OF BABIES AND THE DESTRUCTION OF THE FAMILY. I DON'T KNOW IF MCCAIN IS CHRISTIAN BUT I WILL VOTE FOR HIM BECAUSE I REFUSE TO BE AN ACCOMPLICE TO MURDER! MCCAIN HAS ALWAYS BEEN PRO-LIFE AND AGAINST SAME-SEX MARRIAGES. THAT'S ENOUGH FOR ME TO VOTE FOR HIM INSTEAD OF OBAMA.

    LEARN MORE ABOUT WHAT OBAMA BELIEVES AND THE ISSUES HE SUPPORTS AND OPPOSES...YOU WILL BE SURPRISED GET INFORMED VISIT MY BLOG

    ANSWERS2WHY.BLOG.COM

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 11:58 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 2

    And yet I must admit that 984 is correct.

    We cannot legislate morality. We cannot force others to be Christian. Neither is a majority a sign of Gods intentions...Gods kingdom is established in the hearts of believers.

    In essence we are to uphold Christs Word personally, not in a blanket fashion upon those that do not believe.,

    And yes, even voting is not sacrosant.

    We should go where we are accepted and leave where we are not. Hence, we are wanderers and should avoid politicking.

    This is our cross that we must bear...not hoping in political effort, but only in Christ.

    So 984, I apologize for being arrogant and insulting.

    Take care.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:54 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

    1st, hoooww??
    2nd, whyyyyy?
    3rd, GO TECH!!! (to redraider)

    And last, but not least, I'd like to mention a fun fact: Did you know that about 87.68% of statistics are made up on the spot?? Seriously, about 96.25% of all statistics are false!

    hehe <.<

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:48 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Factual error... the piece says "the public relations guru pointed out that one-third of white evangelicals had voted for former president Bill Clinton in his 1996 re-election bid during the 'height of [the] Monica Lewinsky mess.'"

    Not so... the Lewinsky "mess" erupted in January, 1998, 15 months after Clinton's re-election.

    His re-election was a combination of a weak GOP candidate (Bob Dole) and a backlash to the Republicans fumbling the ball on the government shutdown showdown in late 1995. He was also helped by the Oklahoma City bombing, which took the country's focus away from what brought the GOP to power in 1994 in the "Contract with America" and put public support behind their "leader."

    Of course, we now have a weak GOP candidate, and the Republicans are fumbling the ball more and more, it seems, every day.

  • artm »
    Mon Jun 09, 2008 7:02 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 4

    May God deliver this Nation from certain destruction. America is a Nation that has forsaken God. And that which calls itself the Church is not much better.

    I pray that those who are truly following after the God of the Bible, Will seek God for a Genuine Revival, For I see no other solution for the woes of this Country.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:47 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 4

    Of course there are aspects of this argument that can be discussed further.

    For example, democracies without a Christian majority will fail or never emerge for various reasons, but mainly because people eventually will not understand the meaning of Christ and the cross, and ultimately what freedom is...

    this is what we have allowed to happen in our societies. One can posit that it was, in a sense, understood to be a weakness that could only be strengthened by Christians remaining faithful to Christ, by actively preaching His Word, feeding on His Word and fellowshipping in His Spirit.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:34 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 2

    984,

    As regards to voting and whether a Christian ought to vote, it seems to me unwise and almost unChristian not to vote. Let me explain,

    From a Christian standpoint a democracy is not so much a kingdom.... or at least it ought not to be considered one. Today, there are kingdoms like that of Saudi Arabia...

    In these kingdoms, people are subservient to the King. They do the Kings bidding. They are known as subjects of the King and the realm...that is, their power is based on obeying the Kings demands.

    Since Christ has made us free, we are no more subjects as we are brothers and sisters of our saviour. Hence we choose not to have kingdoms, but to have democracies.

    What is the difference you may ask?
    since you have lost all hope in our democracy, and it seems, in our right to free speech which must remain in order to continue a democracy.?!

    The difference is that while in a kingdom, it is the King that holds power, in a democracy it is the people who hold power and elect ministers or more clearly servants to carry out the bidding of the people.

    Hence, in Christs Kingdom, those who believe are not subjects but co-rulers, and to extend this way of thinking to our days, it is we that hold power and make decisions being mature enough in Christ and His Word to proceed to do so...yet not perfect.

    So, your point about not voting is at the least irresponsible and in fact, it incites against democracy and Christianity...

    We will not have Kings, or religious rulers no more, but will choose servants from ourselves to do our bidding. This bidding must be done with respect to our ability to discuss within ourselves the best approaches and responses...and can only be done through free speech...something that both islamists and atheists are adamantly against.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:39 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    Justme 984: Your Bible quotes are correct ,but as Jesus said to the Sadducees "do you not therefore err, because you know not the scriptures nor the power of God?" Everything you said apart from the verses is needing a response. Which I don't have time for presently but
    will pray for Jesus to make Himself real to you. That's what really matters.here. Forget everything else.

  • Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:15 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    It is a shame that many Christians would vote for Obama. Their campaign always talks about the health of the country such as environmental issues and healthcare for all which are noble causes, despite the fact they never state clearly how it will come about; however, what about the moral health of the country which they do not seem to espouse. Obama advocates abortion, more so than any other presidential contender before him plus he advocates gay marraiges. I do not promote discrimination against gays as only God is the judge of all but promoting marraiges for them is a travesty of God's original commandment. I think all evangelicals, devout Catholics and other Christians should think twice about voting for this man as I am afraid he will bring America down lower on the moral scale.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:57 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 2

    984,

    Atheism has killed more people in the past century than Christianity has in the last 2000 years.. There is no equivalence.

    As regards to Jesuss command. I agree. We ought to not politicize religion. Yet, how often have you gone on a muslim site to spout your rant as regards to eeping religion out of politics?

    In any muslim country, and there are over 50 of them, religion is essential. Christians are systematically persecuted by these governments...

    how often have you gone on a muslim website, or an atheist website to speak against their attack on societies and given them some advice?

    There is plenty to talk to the atheists about. Their agenda has fueled the greatest problems that we face today in education and law...

    As regards to war...people have a right to defend themselves and to help others who are being mass slaughtered...They still are digging up mass graves from Saddams day..

    There are things far worst than war.. things like nazism and islamism and communism that despite people being disarmed are still being persecuted and silently mass slaughtered in their millions.

    As regards to whom we vote for...we, as Americans have an inaliable right to vote and to discuss publicly whom we wilsh to vote for.

    If you prefer to live in ideologicalcaves, I would not be surprised to find you in one with Osama, and others of his ilk who are doing thier best to take these rights away from us.

    So go, in the name of God go to whatever cave you came from and leave us alone.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 10:01 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 4

    Jesus said "My Kingdom is not of this world" There is no direction in the bible to mix christianity with politics! "Render unto Ceasar that which is Ceasars and unto God that which is Gods". God is no repect of persons, we as Americans are no more special in his eyes than the lowest people in the poorest parts of this planet. Morality can not be legislated. History has shown Christianity to be just as muderous as Islam, communism, nazism, and despotism. Nothing new under the sun. What would Jesus do? He would not vote! neither candidates follow christian precepts.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 8:35 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Tha world's ship is sinking.The question is who is the better captain to slow our descent into the depths giving time to the evaccuees? The apostasy is a Biblical given. God has kept it in
    check by various means. Are we part of the restraint of evil or not? Anyway, as a dear preacher said , "We have all eternity to rejioce in the victory(ies) ,but only one hour to save the
    lost. " Make like men prepared to meet your God. :-)

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:18 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 4

    If Obama wins 40% of the Evanjellicals, then the church is not only decadent, but apostate as well. We are entering the time of no confidence in the church, and a time where Christians have lost all credibility. For those of you who believe you are Christian, here are a couple of questions to ponder:

    1. How do you justify your faith by supporting one of the most pro-choice political candidates in recent history, and a candidate who will continue to support the murder of the unborn?

    2. How do you justify your faith by supporting one of the most radical proponents of homosexual rights and homosexual marriage in recent history? He wants the total homosexualization of this nation!!!

    There are those of us out here who do NOT support this radical agenda, and will not accept the Obama Presidency as legitimate, due to a couple of the above issues, but the reasons for not supporting him are legion!!!

    Most of all, if 40% of Christians support him, this message is for you:

    REPENT, FOR THE KINGDOM OF GOD IS AT HAND!!!!

  • DRJ »
    Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:15 pm Agree: 7   Disagree: 4

    Please try to remember a few facts about B. Hussein Obama. He is without a doubt the most seriously unqualified person to run for president in a long time. Look at his voting record, his time in public office, his significant associates, and his national background. Doesn't anyone realize that the president gets to hand-pick federal judges and ambassadors. Also key cabinet members! Do you realize how much trouble this man could create and for how long a period into the future this man could cripple our natioin? THINK before you get on the bandwagon and ride the crest of a tide of popular opinion generated and sustained by a completely leftist liberal media! Some of the most significant men in his background are America-haters and caucasion haters. A vote for Obama is a vote for the downfall of this and many other nations around the world! It's time to wIpe the the star-shine out of your eyes and THINK about our future in the hands of a man created by the hyper-liberal-rmedia and promoted by some of the wealthiest socialists in America. Please get off of your favorite party bias and look at the truth. The position of the most powerful man in the world needs to be held by one of the most politically experienced, military savvy, America-loving MAN in the world.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 6:39 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 5

    You know we do not have to choose sides here. Neither candidate are very Godly men. McCain will win this Presidentsy, it was manipulated to run Hillary & Obama to split the democratic vote. People are now going to vote for McCain just to keep Obama out. politics is an evil world! McCain is pro war that is not Christian, I would think being a vet subject to torture his rhetoric would be to STOP TORTURE and End this maddening war now. We are going to have another Bush in office--and remember He was "christian" God told him to invade Iraq.. I'd like to know did God tell him to lie to Us and the world? Jesus said His kingdom is NOT of this world. These candidates are.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 6:35 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 3

    Wjneill,

    It seems to me that you, the atheist and the islamists have a lot more in common than you think.

    In Christianity there are a lot of sects, and at the same time there are many arguments as to what constitues a Christian. These arguments are freely made available, so that people can decide for themselves, or argue their points to shed more light on the subject...

    But, it is people like you, the atheists and the islamists that cannot tolerate discussions and as a result resort to cancelling free speech and persecuting and torturing those that disagree.

    Stalin, an atheist and Mao were not willing to discuss anything...but between them they killed over 90 million people if not more.

    The islamists dont want a discussion on mohammed their founder...and when the truth is made obvious by a cartoon, they riot and kill people.

    Consequently it is people like the atheists(yourself) that pursue and are pursuing attempts at satisfying murderous peacelovers...quieting any and all dissension and discussions.
    This ultimately is what islamists want and what your kind of thinking is allowing them to have.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 4:20 pm Agree: 7   Disagree: 3

    The word Evangelical has thoroughly lost its meaning.

    The article should read, "Obama could garner 40% of Christians who have little to no moral hiearchy of Values."

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 4:06 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    dongard,
    I'm curious as to how you drew your perspective. Are you part of Christ's followers? If so, even if you disagree with them + feel they are misguided, they are your family, your brothers + sisters.

    If you speak from outside the church, then how can you understand their strong feelings about those who call themselves a follower of Christ but disregard His teachings?

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 3:48 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 2

    smbga

    you are a victim of landrusim ie

    the abusive effects of hypocritical Christianity, and how in some cases people who behave perfectly decently at church, at work, and other places where they know they'll be recognized, they are models of virtue. We refer to the people who devoutly believe they have been saved and that they serve the purpose of the Lord, yet are the same ones who practice racism - including violence - towards people not of their faith, color, or economic background.

    or as spock would observe about our recent history

    "quite possibly they are without guidance for the first time in their lives"

    "fascinating"

    hint google landru

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 2:59 pm Agree: 6   Disagree: 2

    The comments registered to this moment are both fascinating and frightening.

    Most of you are positing that you are more of a Christian than others leaving comments as well as the overall population of the United States.

    Within Islam, there are multiple schisms with the two fundamental branches, Sunni and Sh'ia. Each of the schisms alleges that it is more pure and original than any other "brand" of Islam and brooks absolutely minimal tolerance of the other "brands". Killing the infidels is often the means used to clean out the impure.

    So, that being the case, what makes you, as Christians, any different from the radical Islamists? Are any of you more Christian that your neighbors? Your kith and kin? Your personal friends? What makes you different from the jihadists who want to impose only their perception of one, true religion upon all others?

    Ultimately, was Jesus selective in who he healed? Was he selective who who he shared his words?

    If not, what gives you the right to be selective, as well as unashamedly vindictive towards those who do not share your version of Christ's words? Are you truly Christians?

    Or are you heathens?

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 2:12 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 4

    You are not in the Kingdom of God if you consider voting for Obama.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 2:00 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 4

    star 2
    "I read somewhere that Obama said that if there is trouble he would side with the Muslims. For sure, there will be trouble. If Obama becomes President, and he sides with the Muslims, will that in time result in America being forced to becomes an Islamic nation with the law of the land being shiria law? Obama has the qualities that fit real nicely into the antichrist system. May God help us. Christians, get your spiritual house in order, and live for God with all your heart for our redemption draweth nigh."

    this is outright fearmongering. you don't give a source you don't give the context. all you do it try to put words into someone else's mouth. from where i stand it looks like bearing false witness to me.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:30 am Agree: 5   Disagree: 6

    Yes! Obama '08!!

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:22 am Agree: 6   Disagree: 5

    I want to add that this story upset me. Evangelical in the same sentence as Obama is such hypocrisy. Who are these Evangelicals that this article is referring to? Obama has voted for partial birth abortion, is por choice and gay rights. How can any sincere Christian consider endorsing him? By endorsing him you are denying Him.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:15 am Agree: 4   Disagree: 5

    No Christians/Evangenicals should be supporting Obama or any democrat.

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 12:31 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 2

    Subject: REMOVE FATHER PFLEGER

    YOU BETTER SIGN THIS PETITION RIGHT NOW !!!

    http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/removable-of-father-michael-pfleger




    Pfleger thought no one was watching
    Columnist Falsani asked Fr. Pfleger the obvious question: as a friend and
    passionate supporter of Obama’s campaign for president, how could he do what he
    did from the Trinity Church pulpit with the cameras rolling?

    This is directly from the column:

    ‘Pfleger’s short answer? He didn’t think the service and his “conversation” — a
    more casual address than a classic sermon, he explained — were being broadcast
    live online, as Trinity often does. ‘They told me it was down,’ Pfleger said.
    ‘Their live streaming had been down all day, and they didn’t know whether it
    was
    back up…I regret…that I was naive enough to believe (this) was just going to be
    kept among the church.’
    Falsani article


    http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/removable-of-father-michael-pfleger

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 12:30 am Agree: 6   Disagree: 4

    Obama supports "LIVE BIRTH ABORTIONS"

    Barack Obama is on record as orchestrating the defeat of Illinois’ Born Alive
    Infants Protection Act. (Jill Stanek has documented this extensively.) While it
    is obvious that everyone in the pro-life community finds this sufficiently
    repulsive to vote for whoever (or whatever) is running against Obama, no
    self-respecting pro-choice person is going to stand with Obama on this either.
    Jerrold Nadler (D-NY, one of the most liberal members of Congress) said of the
    Federal version of this legislation, “There is no such thing as a right to a
    live birth abortion.”

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 12:28 am Agree: 5   Disagree: 6

    Obama just doesn’t get it… He needs to explain theses beliefs and stop insulting
    Christians by claiming to be one..This is not Christianity !!

    The Obamas have practiced Black
    Theology from the writing of Marxist, James H. Cone… for 20 years !!!

    this is what his church taught his daughters on Sundays…

    “Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the
    goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against white people,
    then he is a murderer and we had better kill him. The task of black theology is
    to kill gods who do not belong to the black community. Black theology will
    accept only the love of God which participates in the destruction of the white
    enemy. What we need is the divine love as expressed in black power which is the
    power of black people to destroy their oppressors here and now by any means at
    their disposal. Unless God is participating in his holy activity, we must reject
    his love.”

    and Obama himself… before TUCC….

    Malcolm X’s autobiography seemed to offer something different,” Obama wrote.
    “His repeated acts of self-creation spoke to me; the blunt poetry of his
    words,
    his unadorned insistence on respect, promised a new and uncompromising order,
    martial in its discipline, forged through sheer force of will.”

    While working as a community organizer for a group of churches in Chicago,
    Obama
    was repeatedly asked to join Christian congregations, but begged off.

    How can this man represent all Americans ?

  • Sun Jun 08, 2008 12:24 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 3

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_N1rqVo2W0

    Too Many scary associations and unanswered questions about Obama ??

  • ram »
    Sun Jun 08, 2008 12:10 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    It seems to me that in the mix of all the politics, christians are forgetting what McCain has
    done that no other politician can come close to and that is: Greater love has no one than
    this, than to lay down one's life for his friends. John 15:13 To me his actions have spoken
    louder than anything else that's being said, and bringing honor to all who preceded
    before him and to all who follow in his footsteps this present day.

  • Sat Jun 07, 2008 10:44 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

    I will vote for McCain. I do not support a party that has has no qualms in keeping senator Byrd, who has remained a KKK activist, and is now backing another KKK activist of just a different colour.

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