Updated 11:59 pm.EST, Sun November 22, 2009

Society|Tue, Sep. 02 2008 09:39 AM EDT

Dobson Commends Palin's Support of Pregnant Daughter

By Liz Sidoti|Associated Press Writer

The campaign said it was not disclosing the father's full name or age or how he and Bristol knew each other, citing privacy.

Sarah Palin's fifth child, a son named Trig, was born in April with Down syndrome. Internet bloggers have been suggesting that the child was actually born to Bristol Palin but that her mother, the 44-year-old Alaska governor, claimed to be the mother.

Palin spokesman Bill McAllister emphatically denied those rumors, and McCain adviser Mark Salter said the campaign announced the daughter's pregnancy to rebut them.

"Senator McCain's view is this is a private family matter. As parents, (the Palins) love their daughter unconditionally and are going to support their daughter," said McCain spokesman Steve Schmidt.

Reaction from religious conservatives was sympathetic.

Focus on the Family founder James Dobson issued a statement commending the Palins "for not just talking about their pro-life and pro-family values, but living them out even in the midst of trying circumstances." He added: "Being a Christian does not mean you're perfect. Nor does it mean your children are perfect. But it does mean there is forgiveness and restoration when we confess our imperfections to the Lord."

Roberta Combs, president of the Christian Coalition of America called the pregnancy private. "It's a matter that should stay in the family and they have to work through it together. My prayers go out to them."

Added Combs: "We're excited about the governor and think she's going to do well."

Mathew Staver, dean of Liberty University School of Law, said: "We're all sinners."

"We all make mistakes. Certainly, the ideal is not to get pregnant out of wedlock. But she made the right decision after her mistake," he said.

McCain advisers said Palin told them about the pregnancy during lengthy discussions about her background. At several points during the discussions, McCain's team warned Palin that the scrutiny into her private life would be intense.

Advisers said Palin's daughter should be afforded privacy like the other candidates' children. Said Schmidt: "If people try to politicize this, the American people will be appalled."

In Monroe, Mich., Democrat Obama condemned rumors involving the children of candidates and echoed the McCain campaign argument. He said, "I think people's families are off limits, and people's children are especially off limits."

"Our people were not involved in any way in this, and they will not be," he said. "And if I ever thought that there was somebody in my campaign that was involved in something like that, they'd be fired."

Associated Press Writers Eric Gorski in St. Paul, Charles Babington in Monroe, Mich., and Steve Quinn in Anchorage, Alaska, contributed to this report.

Copyright 2008 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
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  • Mon Sep 08, 2008 6:56 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    "Almost all the gays that post on CP are Catholic and are trusting in their infantile baptism and confirmation that had them confessing a belief in a God that never drew them to Jesus convicting them of their sins, their need for a Savior, and that Savior was Jesus Christ. "

    Who cares about people on CP Star, look at some of the biggest christian gays like Haggard or Craig.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:30 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    chicago, great and meaningful thoughts to make a great Lord's Day even better, be blessed my brother, believer

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:04 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Believer and Star: I'm sure this was a trial for Palin and I do appreciate the fact that she acknowledged the struggles that her family has had. If she and McCain get elected, I feel encouraged that she will be on the forefront of advocated for individuals with disabilities (a population I serve in the state of Illinois).

    You know, the fact that we humans have a God-given ability to bring about so much goodness when affliction occurs is what attracts me to Christianity; the theme of death-and-resurrection that continually plays a role in our lives; that solidarity with the crucified and risen Christ. (I think it's important for me to verbalize it ever so often.)

    Believer: thanks for understanding.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 9:25 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    chicago24

    Excerpts from www.adn.com/626/story/382864.html

    Palins' child diagnosed with Down syndrome (04/22/08)

    FAMILY FEELS BLESSED: Back at work already, governor says she wasn't in labor in Texas.

    By LISA DEMER
    ldemer@adn.com

    Published: April 22nd, 2008 01:11 AM
    Last Modified: April 22nd, 2008 07:49 PM

    Gov. Sarah Palin was back at work Monday in Anchorage, holding a meeting on the proposed natural gas pipeline three days after giving birth to her fifth child.

    She and her husband, Todd, showed their new baby, Trig Paxson Van Palin, to a few reporters and photographers and answered questions about his condition and the sooner-than-expected delivery.

    Trig has Down syndrome, a genetic abnormality that affects a child's intellectual and physical development, the governor confirmed.

    "When we first heard, it was kind of confusing," Palin, 44, said. She called the revelation "very, very challenging" and said she initially felt sad.

    But the family has worked through that. Palin said she and Todd feel blessed and chosen by God. With a big family including four older kids, grandparents, aunts and uncles, Palin said, they will have lots of support for what's ahead. In their eyes, she said, "he's absolutely perfect."

    The oldest Palin kid, Track, is in the Army and texted his mother after learning the news with something to the effect of "This is just so cool -- I finally got my brother."

    In a letter she e-mailed to relatives and close friends Friday after giving birth, Palin wrote, "Many people will express sympathy, but you don't want or need that, because Trig will be a joy. You will have to trust me on this." She wrote it in the voice of and signed it as "Trig's Creator, Your Heavenly Father."

    "Children are the most precious and promising ingredient in this mixed-up world you live in down there on Earth. Trig is no different, except he has one extra chromosome," Palin wrote.

    As for people who think a baby like Trig shouldn't even be born, look around, the governor wrote. Who is perfect or even normal?

    Palin said she won't take maternity leave but will go with Trig to doctor's visits, physical therapy, whatever he needs. She's breast feeding and plans to bring Trig to work with her, just as she did with Piper.

    "It just feels like he fits perfectly," Palin said. "He is supposed to be here with us."

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 9:24 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    pvlman, I've heard Dr. Dobson numerous times thank parents who were encouraging their teens during difficult circumstances such as unplanned pregnancies. But it amazes me how many parents encourage their daughters to get an abortion even though the daughter would prefer keeping the child and possibly put the child up for adoption.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 9:19 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    chicago, my apology for assuming and to be honest it did sound out of character for you, but I would say she did struggle some with that issue, but perhaps not as much as a person who is not as committed to pro-life views as she is. Thanks for your gracious response.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 7:47 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Why didn't Dobson commend ALL parents who support their pregnant teen daughters or is such commendation reserved for Republican candidates? Yes it's great that Sarah Palin is able to take her take here son to work and care for him. She is lucky to be able to do so. How soon will Christians, be pressuring corporations to put the means in place so more, working mothers can do the same? Again ALL mothers just not those who are at the executive or management levels. Of course Christians who are not Catholic, have to find problems with Catholics. They have to jusify to themselves the liberal act of those split from the Catholic faith. The word liberal used here in it's true meaning, not in the perjorative manner too many use it in.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 5:42 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Believer: I would have never implied that she kept her child to be politically correct. What I meant was that she already had a pro-life stance and would have never considered aborting her baby in the first place.
    The Republicans have jumped on the bandwagon, implying that she may have battled with the choice once she learned the child had Down syndrome.
    She obviously never considered abortion as an option.
    I was criticizing the Republican pundits; not her.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 2:04 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    chicago, I know we disagree on several issues, but that was really a low blow to suggest she kept her son Trig in order to be politically correct. Totally uncool.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 2:00 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    DP, I said a prayer for your son and his unit, so drive safe and look forward to hearing from you soon, be blessed as you continue to serve Him.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:17 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Just FYI, my son got deployed yesterday so I'll be headed out to pick up his car. I know just how much you'll miss me Ifeelfine72 and others but...you'll just have to get along without me for a few days. :D

    I understand Kansas has two elevations...flat and flater.

    I might get a chance to post in the morning. Later!

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:35 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Does anyone actually think that Palin ever considered, for one moment, having an abortion when she learned that her baby had Down syndrome?
    No way! Her anti-abortion stance well-known. This was a no-brainer for her and hardly meritorious on her part.
    I think it's pretty pitiful the way the Republicans are spinning this in order to garner the evangelical vote.

  • Sun Sep 07, 2008 1:18 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    ifeelfine72 - Below are some excerpts from a news article detailing the level of involvment Mrs Palin has with her children.

    Gov. Mom
    The Land of the Midnight Sun's New Claim To Fame: Being Led by a 24-Hour Mother

    Excerpts taken from http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/01/AR2008090102998.html


    The facts of life for Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin are fascinating and seem, frankly, exhausting. Her children range in age from 18 years to 4 months. Track, the oldest, recently enlisted in the Army and is headed for Iraq. Daughter Willow, 14, is in high school, and Piper is 7. The baby, Trig, was born in April with Down syndrome.

    Palin has carefully portrayed herself throughout her career as someone committed to both family and profession -- and tough enough to handle both. She made a show of dismissing the chef at the governor's mansion saying she wanted to do her own cooking, and that the kids were old enough to make their own sandwiches. And no one can recall her ever having a full-time babysitter.

    "You walk into her office and Piper is sitting there, the baby is in the crib -- that's just the way it is. This is how she lives her life. Someone who was in a meeting with her recently said she was discreetly nursing Trig," said Palin's biographer Kaylene Johnson.

    From interviews with those closest to Palin emerges a description of a hectic lifestyle, but one in which the hominess and rural community of Alaska have enabled her to have her kids around her while she works and have offered a deep bench of family and friends for child-care support. She has shown up to meetings and news conferences carrying Trig in a baby pouch.

    She and her husband kept their family house in the small town of Wasilla, where her parents, three siblings and closest friends live. Most of the year, she is able to commute back and forth from Anchorage daily, except when the legislature is in session in Juneau. Todd Palin is currently on leave from his job as an oil field worker, making it possible for him to be a full-time dad, said two friends. Sarah Palin's mother said ...that Palin's two youngest girls, Willow and Piper, attended school in Juneau for the second semester last year when the legislature was in session to be near their mother. The baby was also with Palin.

    Trig Paxton Van Palin could end up being the best-traveled infant in America. Campaign sources said that the baby would be with his mother a good part of the time, and that arrangements are being made to have a babysitter travel with them. Confirms grandmother Sally Heath, "I can't imagine she would leave him behind."

  • Sat Sep 06, 2008 11:43 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Governor Palin still has an active role in her family's life. She takes her baby to work with her. She has Trig with her in her business meetings, changes his diapers in her office, and etc. The kids come in and out of the office during the day. Their drawings are under the glass top of her desk and etc. She let go the chef hired by the state to cook for the Governor's family and cooks for her family herself.

  • Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:26 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    ifeelfine, the exception is she is presently the Governor of Alaska and from the articles I've read she and her husband are doing a good job in balancing both her role as a Mom and as Governor. She is very involved in the life of her children and even when she was presented with the option of aborting her son Trig because he has downs syndrome she and her family opted to keep the child. Sounds like a pretty good Mom to me.

  • Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:21 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    ifeelfine, I didn't call him a name I just called him a hypocrite, color me confused. Plus how would you know if the husbands of the women he interviewed were stay at home Dads? You're grasping for straws here and there coming up short. Plus would calling Republicans, Repuglicans not be considered name-calling?

  • Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:03 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    believer: I didn't call him names. I called out his hypocrisy. And yes, it is hypocrisy. Those exceptions were few and usually involved a stay at home dad. She is not choosing to stay at home during their formative years. . . what exception does she fall under? The one for repuglicans?

  • Sat Sep 06, 2008 9:23 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    ifeelfine, oh and by the way over the years he's had many women on his Focus on the Family broadcasts who were not stay at home Moms.

  • Sat Sep 06, 2008 9:22 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    ifeelfine, he's a speaker not a preacher and even though he believes the best option is that mothers stay home to be with their children especially during their formative years, he also acknowledges that there are exceptions to the rule. So how does that make him a hypocrite? Before you start name-calling you might want to do your homework.

  • Sat Sep 06, 2008 8:28 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Of course Dobson is still a hypocrite as he's preached for 30 years that women should stay at home with the kids . . . I haven't heard a peep out of him on that particular subject this time around. It just shows he's more interested in Repuglican politics - no surprises there.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 10:02 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "The problem with Catholisism is that to some degree..."

    Hey...the church I go to is Baptist... :)

    When I lived in the Philippines they were mostly Catholic. I can tell you there is a bit of difference between their Catholic and what we have here in the USA. Just personal observation.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:16 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Yes, believer, absolutely!

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:06 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    star2, Matthew 6:7 is a verse he should take literally wouldn't you say! :)

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:03 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    tallguy, Hebrews 10:10, "By this will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all." Also, I Peter 3:18, "For Christ also died for sins once for all...." Other verses are Hebrews 7:27, "He doesn't need to offer sacrifices every day as high priests do, first for their own sins, then for those of the people. He did it once for all when He offered Himself." also 9:12, and 9:28.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:57 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Tallguy1000 said, "There is no problem with Catholicism." [End quote]

    Cubans Prepare Centenary of Patron (Zenit.org): "Our Lady of Cobre is the Mother of all Cubans, they add, and a 'beacon of hope and the promise of a better future.'" [End quote]

    Yes, we do have a problem, when multitudes are being so sadly misdirected to one who has no such heavenly power. May our Cuban neighbors come out of such deception and receive the following truths:

    "Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;" --1Ti 1:1

    "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;" --Tit 2:13

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:49 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Jesus said "Who is my mother, or my brothers, but they that do the will of my Father."
    You do the will of our Father so you must be Jesus' mother, and since the Catholic believe that the mother of Jesus also bears the title of Mother of God, then that means you.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:48 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    tallguy, because it doesn't, as Paul says we do this in rememberance of what Christ did for us on Calvary and Christ said the very same thing on the night He instituted the Lord's Supper. But more importantly in Romans 6:10 it says, "For in that He died, He died to sin ONCE for all; but in that He lives, He lives to God." What you believe is that every time you celebrate the Lord's Supper you are actually recrucifying Christ if the bread literally becomes His body and is broken again and if you believe that the wine literally becomes the blood of Christ is shed once more. This practice and belief is totally contrary to the Word of God. The Lord's Supper is a symbolic remembrance of the Crucifixion of Christ which needs to be done in a worthy and holy manner.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:39 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Tallguy

    Pray the rosary? Why? Do you not take Jesus' words seriously? Are they not literal?

    Matthew 6:7 - "But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking."

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:33 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Prophet - A mother of God? How is that?

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:23 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Star,
    Do you know that according to Catholic beliefs that you are a mother of God?

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:07 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    More scriptures on crucifying the flesh:

    Galatians 2:20 - "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me."


    Galatians 5:24 - "And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts."

    Galatians 6:14 - "But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world."

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:38 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Susan is a mother of God, too.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:37 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Romans 12:1
    "I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service."

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:35 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Romans 6:6
    Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:34 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Galatians 524
    "And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts."

    So have you crucified yourself yet?

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:23 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    Prophet: where in the word does it say we are to crucify ourselves?

    believer: It is the Spirit that gives life. The flesh is of no avail. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life.

    All the way through this passage of John Ch 6 Jesus is saying this is My flesh. Notice the word My. Later on He says "the" flesh. This refers to our earthly flesh which truly is of no avail. Spirit and life.... Jesus tells us that what he said about the Bread of Life is by the revelation of the Spirit.

    Does this shock you? --- Jesus was clearly speaking literally. What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending? If you can believe in the ascension, why can't you believe that this bread and wine truly become His body?

    Paul Daniel:
    The problem with Catholisism is that to some degree...

    There is no problem with Catholicism. You're right though, some people do go off course and I agree, this has to be corrected from time to time. Amen!

    God bless all of you.... <><...

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:36 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Tallguy,
    Have you crucified yourself lately?

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:42 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Tallguy, Jesus declared that those words were not to be taken literally when He wnet on to say in vs.63, "the Spirit is the one who gives life. The flesh doesn't help at all. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life." His words totally rule out the physical and literal meaning of the words. And even Augustine at the end of the 4th century said,"it is therefore a figure bidding us communicate in the sufferings of our Lord, and secretly and profitably treasure in our hearts the fact that His flesh was crucified and pierced for us." He also said, "Crede et manducasti, Believe, and thou hast eaten.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:07 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Just scratch the previous post. I'll try to delete it later!

    Hey, Tx... I consider this place to be an open discussion so I don't take much personally! Still, thanks.

    The problem with Catholisism is that to some degree it's like saying you're Baptist. There is the core belief and then many preists go out on their own on some things...thus the Vatican has to do some internal correction from time to time.

    Still, John 6:53-54 translates the word 'eat'. However, the greek word is used both literally and figuratively. It is used for both.

    John 6:35 says "...and he who believes in Me shall never thirst". So, if this isn't figurative then if you get thirsty then you're not a believer.

    Also, the word that is translated 'is' is strongs greek #2076 where the usage of the word is defined as "(that) is (to say). This is a figurative sense of the word. The word for a literal use of 'is' is a different greek word. This is the 'is' where Jesus says "this is my body".

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:05 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Sorry about that. I tried to delete and repost as well as flag it but the controls aren't working.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:01 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Messages that contain flames, profanity or personal attacks may be edited or removed from the forum and your access to the forum may be Hey, Tx... I consider this place to be an open discussion so I don't take much personally! Still, thanks.

    The problem with Catholisism is that to some degree it's like saying you're Baptist. There is the core belief and then many preists go out on their own on some things...thus the Vatican has to do some internal correction from time to time.

    Still, John 6:53-54 translates the word 'eat'. However, the greek word is used both literally and figuratively. It is used for both.

    John 6:35 says "...and he who believes in Me shall never thirst". So, if this isn't figurative then if you get thirsty then you're not a believer.

    Also, the word that is translated 'is' is strongs greek #2076 where the usage of the word is defined as "(that) is (to say). This is a figurative sense of the word. The word for a literal use of 'is' is a different greek word.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 10:17 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Paul Daniel, I say this in kindness, but you really don't know what you are talking about. Please stop proclaming what I believe as a Catholic until you truly have the facts! You have never taken the time to truly research your claims. This would be like you trying to explain nuclear physics to us by what you've "heard". Sorry, I'd rather hear it from someone who works in th nuclear industry.

    Quit spreading rumors about the Holy Catholic Church. You're only repeating what you've "heard". You've NEVER researched.

    Soooooo.... I'm reading through your answer to Mike's question about the Gospel of John Chapter 6.../

    "Unless you eat my body and drink my blood, you shall not have life within you."

    I've checked various versions, yet I fail to see the word "symbol" anywhere. Where does it say that salvation is in Holy Communion? Stick to the word!

    In fact, Christ's words were too difficult and the majority thought he was nuts,... they choose to walk away. Did Jesus stop them? Did He say he was just kidding... fellows I wasn't serious, I'm only speaking symbolicaly? No, he let them leave! He asked the others if they want to leave too.

    So I guess you're right Danile Paul, looks like you ARE in good company!

    I remain in Christ...<><...

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 9:33 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    "we're fine without your stupid opinions!"

    My, my. Sounds rather fundamentalist if you ask me....

    Here's the problem tall guy... most issues here end up being between the position of the Gospel and the position of the world. The Gospel is die to self and live for Christ. It doesn't take long before one of the Catholics here brings up a question to which we give the Gospel's response as did happen in this case.

    Catholics teach confession not conversion. Many Catholics believe all they have to do is say 20 Hail-Mary's and stuff and it's OK. They can do whatever again and just come back for more Hail-Mary's. The Bible says to Jesus paid the price for sin's. He bought us with a price. We are His now (no Hail-Mary's involved). It's all His doing and not ours.

    I happened to be raised in a mostly Catholic town. In fact, the Bible college bought their new campus from the Jesuit Preists. So, I do know a bit about it. In fact, many Catholics are taught from a young age to think 'born again' Christians are stupid so I do understand where your comment is coming from.

    As for me, I believe all people are equally lost until they find Jesus. In the grand scheme of things there is no difference between the best of us and the worst of us. We are all sinners in need of a savior. Sin is not OK no matter how many times you confess it and say Hail-Mary's.

    Just FYI, from what I have read in the Gospels...many of the religious leaders felt Jesus teachings were stupid. "Who is this son of a carpenter...from Naz!" Who does he think He is? We're the teachers of the law!

    It leaves me in good company! :-)

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:46 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Get over it Tallguy. Posters respond to comments made by other posters. Such was the case on this thread.

  • Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:27 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    What is wrong with you people? The topic is not infant baptism or your humble opinions of whether Holy Catholic People are saved or not (don't worry about it, we are) the topic is:

    Dobson Commends Palin's Support of Pregnant Daughter....

    Stay on the topic. Don't worry so much about Catholics, we're fine without your stupid opinions!

    May the Grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Love of God, and the Fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you <><..

  • Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:11 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    star2, phew!, I thought I was having a flashback to my BC days, ha!

  • Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:08 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Sorry believer, I wanted to make it more clear what I meant by being saved.

  • Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:07 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    believer - All the gays I am aware of on CP are Catholic with the exception of feetxxxl.

    You said, "I agree with you as well that if a person is at peace with their sin or sinful lifestyle that's a good indicator they have not had a genuine conversion experience."

    I believe that the gays on CP are at peace with their sin or sinful lifestyle because they are not truly saved (had a genuine conversion experience).

    I am of the opinion that Catholics are not saved, they never had a genuine conversion experience, so that would, in general, give them peace in a lifestyle that God calls sin.

  • Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:07 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    star2, what happened to your last post I was responding to?

  • Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:06 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    star2, excellent point for not only catholics but for anyone who believes they are saved but has only had a false conversion experience at best.

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