Updated 11:59 pm.EST, Mon November 23, 2009

Opinion|Sun, Oct. 05 2008 02:12 PM EDT

Pressure to Keep the Baby?

By R. Albert Mohler, Jr.|Christian Post Guest Columnist

The public presence of little Trig Palin is a powerful witness to the sanctity of human life, and the knowledge that this little infant with Down syndrome is bringing such joy to his family is upsetting those who believe that babies such as Trig should never be born.

The facts are daunting. It is now estimated that between 80 and 90 percent of all unborn babies diagnosed as likely to have Down syndrome are aborted. The availability of prenatal testing presents parents with the possibility of aborting the baby and starting over. The statistics now speak for themselves - the vast majority of parents are choosing to abort under these circumstances.

But the visible presence of Trig Palin in the arms of his parents or one of his sisters is resetting that equation, at least in terms of the public's emotions. The sight of little Piper Palin licking her hand and flattening Trig's hair during their mom's acceptance speech at the Republican National Convention is likely to stick in the public mind years after Trig's hair is again unstuck. It's hard for even the most ardent abortion defenders to insert an argument against Trig's precious life at that point. Or, at least we would think so.

At least one highly-placed source objects to the whole picture. Writing in The Globe and Mail [Toronto], Dr. André Lalonde, executive vice-president of the Society of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists of Canada, explained his worry that other parents might feel pressure to follow the Palins' example.

As the paper explains:

Dr. Lalonde said that above all else, women must be free to choose, and that popular messages to the contrary could have detrimental effects on women and their families.

"The worry is that this will have an implication for abortion issues in Canada," he said.

Taken at face value, the paper seems to be suggesting that a decision to keep the baby contradicts the doctor's assertion that "women must be free to choose." In other words, the only "right" choice would be to abort the baby.

Given the relatively few words quoted from Dr. Lalonde, it is possible that his quote is not fully representative of his position. If this is true, he should certainly make this clear. A look at the Web site of the SOGC indicates that this statement might well be representative of his position.

The group has announced its clear opposition to a proposed Unborn Victims of Crime Act - an act that would allow courts to consider an unborn baby as a victim in assault or murder cases. Such laws are not uncommon in the United States, but the SOGC has taken the position that, once an unborn baby is recognized to have a legal existence and right to live, the entire question of abortion and "reproductive rights" takes on a new frame.

The descent into the Culture of Death is fueled by language such as found here - that a woman might be "pressured to keep the baby" in light of Trig Palin's visibility. At the same time, the inherent evil of such abortions and the slander against humanity represented by the abortion of these babies comes to bright light in Trig Palin's little face.

Maybe Dr. Lalonde and his colleagues are right to be worried. The entire question has been reset by one precious little infant.

Adapted from R. Albert Mohler Jr.'s weblog at www.albertmohler.com.
___________________________________________________

R. Albert Mohler, Jr. is president of The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, Kentucky. For more articles and resources by Dr. Mohler, and for information on The Albert Mohler Program, a daily national radio program broadcast on the Salem Radio Network, go to www.albertmohler.com. For information on The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, go to www.sbts.edu. Send feedback to mail@albertmohler.com. Original Source: www.albertmohler.com.
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  • Tue Oct 14, 2008 8:10 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    elbib, I heartily agree with you that a Christian married women's highest priorities next to obedience to the Great Commandment and joining God in fulfilling His Great Commission should be to her husband and her family which in some ways is a relection of their obedience to the Great Commandment and Great Commission. Once again I think we may differ somewhat in how that looks. And I also agree that as a result of some Christian women ignoring or minimizing those priorities we have many of the problems we do today in both our churches and homes.

  • Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:41 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    DiaryofCross: You say Scripture is pretty clear about homosexuality and I agree, but they say it is clear in their favor. Go to Amazon.com and look for the book "The Children are Free: Reexamining the Biblical Evidence on Same Sex Relationsips. The Scripture is not comprised of rules. It is a culture - God's culture - established for the righteous to live within, regardless of age or worldly culture. When we apply our worldly cultural concepts or situations in the context of Scripture for ourselves (you did this when saying, "back in the days of Paul and Godly women of the time"), we open the door for those who are not sincere about being holy and in the will of God to manipulate Scripture to their liking. Only a literal adherence of God's Word, which will always distinguish itself from the present worldly culture, will hinder the manipulation of a lie. I'm sorry! So much more to say!!!!

  • Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:33 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    believer: I'm a man. Remember the questions star2 commanded me answer? I'm not saying that your wife cannot work in the church with you. That's excellent! The problem is when women leave home to pursue a career and/or abide in the company of other men w/o their husband present, whether working at church or another job. Or other women working at your church with you w/o your wife present. I know of many instances of affairs that have transpired between Christians, whether they were professional singers, ministers, helpers, teachers, whatever. If women would understand there place is in the home, first and foremost, and learn how to dwell there happily, many of the sins that occur in the church or workplace would be eliminated. I believe, God's culture, literally lived, keeps us in righteousness, absent from temptations, wives under submission to their husband or other male relative, and diminishes any false ideas, reproach, or blesphamy from occuring. I will reiterate again. Look at what is happening to marriages and the family in the church, let alone the world.

  • Mon Oct 13, 2008 7:20 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    diary, I don't know what you did but I had no problem reading your last post as I did with the earlier ones with all those marks in it, be blessed as you serve Him, believer

  • Mon Oct 13, 2008 6:55 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I pretty much agree with believer. Scripture is pretty clear on what is right and wrong, such as homosexuality and such, but there's a danger that we can get so caught up in rules that we lose sight of the real reason we're Christians, and that's by the saving blood of Jesus Christ. That's why I added the last verse. It's as if Jesus was asking us which is better, to do good or to follow the rules and sacrifice good? I'm not a wife yet, but if the time comes and I need to support my future husband, I rather go out and get a job to balance my home jobs.

    I also wish to know how I took the Scripture's meaning away, please elaborate. ):

  • Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:00 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib, I don't think anyone is defining away the literalness of the role of married women as stated in the Bible. What I think is in question is the parameters of the married woman's role in the home. I don't know if you are a woman or a man, but my wife would still fall in the category of a stay at home wife. While I was a Pastor she went with me when I visited, I constantly called on her in situations where a Christ-like woman's approach and view was defintely needed to include counseling with women, and she served as the church secretary on a part-time basis. However, she still managed our home well. But without her help in those roles and several others roles she held such as Sunday School teacher and AWANA Leader my effectiveness in the pastorate would have been severely limited. In my perception you and I agree on the priorities of the role of married women in the home, but disagree on what that looks like. From what you shared it appears you see it as one size fits all and I and others see it as one size does not fit all.

  • Mon Oct 13, 2008 3:36 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I find it interesting how the arguements presented here, to logically define away the literalness of Scripture concerning women, are so uncannily similar to how homosexuals attempt to define away the literalness of Romans Chapter 1 and marriage, to justify their ends. It's imperative that the Word of God fit with our feelings, evolved situations, and culture. It can't be any other way. Surely, God couldn't, wouldn't, can't expect......

  • Mon Oct 13, 2008 2:04 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    D: I used Microsoft Word to type that up because CP refreshes the page and *BAM* there goes my text. Plus I copied and pasted the scripture references from El's post.

    Hmm...coding issues with Word and CP? I have to remember that next time. -_-

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:07 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Tallguy, that's no way to talk about people. As I said about someone else, correct people with scripture, pray for them, but dont shut them down.

    DiaryOfCross, those marks show up when we use the apostrophe and the dash from MS Word, or from cut-and-paste from other sites.

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 7:12 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    And...I have these funny little boxes on my post...D:

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 7:11 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    1Tim. 5:14,15: “So I counsel the younger widows to marry, to have children, to manage their homes and to give the enemy no opportunity for slander.” These widows, logically, have either been divorced or their husbands passed away. Their depression made them much weaker spiritually, easier to lead them into Satan’s teachings, not to mention they’re young and inexperienced. Ideally, the best way was to get them to take action and get out of their depression by finding love again and having children (see? They are a joy to have! :D). This way, rumors won’t, well, rub the salt on their wounds and they become stoics or led astray.

    I don’t think these verses imply stewardship but a deeper purpose for women to show Christ-like attitude, gain wisdom, be self-controlled and pure, and not be led astray.

    I tried to sound respectful as I could. It’s hard to tell since no one can tell my tone of voice or other elements that show that I’m not trying to pick a fight. Honestly, I saw those verses and decided to read them and I had a different take on the verses than Elbib. I wanted to add on that.

    In Luke 13:10-17, Jesus healed on the Sabbath and the Synagogue ruler rebuked Jesus for healing on the Sabbath. He replies: “Doesn’t each of you on the Sabbath untie his ox or donkey from the stall and lead it out to give water? Then should not this woman, a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan has kept bound for eighteen long years, be set free on the Sabbath day from what bound her?”

    When a rule is set, sometimes there will be a point where only the rule matters, not anything else. I think Palin has the ability to either crash and burn in her walk with Christ, or show the world what Christ is all about. Though I’d wait and find out, but I hope the Lord will allow her to do that.

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 7:11 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I’d like to reply to Elbib since I feel like I jumped in just to rag on Tallguy. Sorry about that. ^^;;

    In Eph. 5:22-24, Paul calls for women to submit to their husbands, however back in the days of Paul, women had no public standing. They couldn’t vote or carry their own defense so their husbands carry that burden for them, therefore giving in physical submission. Spiritually, the submission was to show a quiet testimony to their husbands, explained more in detail in 1Pet. 3:1-7; it’s a way to show purity and a Christ-like life towards their husbands to either strengthen their resolve for or lead their husbands to Christ. There was a reason for submission because women (no meaning to sound sexist) were considered weaker. How will they lead their husbands, the stronger half, into a Christ-like life? By example, of course, a quiet “honey…I don’t think…” or sweetness can go very far. That was the main purpose, but the question is can Palin display this testimony towards her own husband? It’s possible and can serve a brighter testimony towards her peers in office.

    Titus 2:3-5: Here, Paul tells Titus to teach the older women to be pure so they can teach the younger women to be self-controlled and pure. Examples include a woman is “busy at home, kind, and subject to their husbands.” There’s definitely a debate here because Paul could be just throwing out examples outlining the Godly woman of the time. The point of the passage is that older women teach and pass down wisdom to the younger women so that they can be self-controlled and pure.

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:09 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    All the same, Tallguy, I don't like cursing. I go to a college where I have to put up with it and I don't like to see it on a Christian site even if it's blanked out. Please watch the language, many thanks! :D

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:02 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I'm surprised Tallguy didn't get flagged. I mean, those were really uncalled for comments. :/ Reminds me of a opinion blog where the "conversations" are no more than cursing matches. :/

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:42 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib, thanks for your last post with regards to star2 or myself not being apostates. Plus, I was sincerely disappointed you left the discussion as I know there are many Christian women who are struggling with their role in the home.

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 3:44 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Tallguy: I appreciate your support, but I don't share the same sentiments toward believer and star2 as you. I don't beleive them to be apostate. I wish them the best.

  • igh »
    Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:39 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Praise God he is Good! --Jesus.
    -------------------------------
    And what can we say of man? wicked, liars, deceivers and murderers.
    Don't blame me for those words on man...
    God does not lie and I believe him.

  • igh »
    Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:32 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Tallguy don't be mean. But Truth is known by what comes from it.

    Matthew 11:19 "The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children. "

    Luke 7:34 "The Son of man is come eating and drinking; and ye say, Behold a gluttonous man, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners!
    Luke 7:35 But wisdom is justified of all her children. "

  • Sun Oct 12, 2008 8:10 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    tallguy, so then you believe that all married Christian women are mandated by God to stay at home and not be in the work force. The reality is if this was adhered to to most if not all parochial schools to include the one your own children attend would have to close because they could not find anyone qualified to teach them since a majority of those teaching now are both married and mothers. So before you take a side in an issue you might want to know what the issue is that's being discussed, plus in this matter I thought elbib really wanted to consider the issue as opposed to demand we accept his/her point of view and not question it further.

  • JC »
    Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:23 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    I once had a "discussion" with a pro-abortionist, in which my jaw just about hit the floor. This person said that these babies are actually better off being killed as an embryo rather than having to live in a situation of abuse, poverty, oppression, and the like.

    My response to this person was: While all these things mentioned, poverty, abuse, etc., are horrible and should be condemned by any sane individual, killing them is not the answer!

    It's like rape, another horrid act brought on by a barbaric twisted individual's lust for the flesh. But to kill the baby that is born of this horrible act is not the answer either. This child had nothing to do with it, but yet the punishment of the death penalty has been placed on these babies with the support of the government. How twisted is that?

    Isn't this a lot like saying I should die for the crime that my brother or sister did?


    Beloved, killing life to preserve a way of life is not the answer. Likewise, killing life to prevent a possible shaky future is also not the answer.

    What is the answer then?

    Jesus.

    The people exclaimed to God, "Please give us a cure for AIDS". God said, "I did, you aborted it".

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:19 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    star2: Why don't you tell me what Scripture says?

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:17 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    believer: Your wrong! Nobody took their ball and went home, as you put it. There is nothing more to discuss. Your saved and you know. Far be it from me to try to convince you otherwise. I don't know why you even ask? Other than just to argue.

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:09 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib - What does scripture say about about single Christian women working?

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:02 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib, thank you for your concern but the only lie that could have damned me was to buy the lie that anything or anyone else but Christ alone could save me, but ever since May 31st, 1971, when I put my complete faith and trust in the person and finished work of Christ alone by repenting of my sin and turning to Christ I am quite certain that the blood of Christ was sufficient to both save me and keep me for all eternity. But I am a little disappointed that you've opted to take your ball and go home rather than stay and discuss this issue a little more.

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:14 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    believer: If you are so sure, confident, and knowledgable concerning this issue, why are you asking me? I've given you my opinion, which you sought, with Scripture. If you chose to ignore it and make excuses for doing so, then, yes that is between you and the Lord. Eve looked at the tree and made excuses why she should eat,ignoring the truth. Do what you will. Albeit, if you are wrong, it will be your debt and society will suffer. We are witnessing it today. Believe what you want to believe. Just hope that it's not a lie that will damn you.

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 6:03 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib, so you would be in favor of closing down over 90% of Christian schools since a large majority of their teachers are married Christian women and many of them are moms? My wife was a stay at home mom who had the primary responsibility for homeschooling our son, but prior to that she taught classes in a Christian school and had a powerful impact in the lives of her students. But according to your view of the Bible she should have stayed home and relatively be of no use to God or anyone else. I mean in this day of modern conveniences it does not take an organized woman very long to keep her house in order, so most women would have a whole lot of free time on their hands. Plus she certainly was not teaching for the money since at that time Christian school teachers made very little money. I praise God that she stayed home with our son during his formative years, but that is what she believed God called her to, God and her made the decision the same way it is the wife who must choose to be submissive to her husband. You say that you believe Lydia quit working once she became a Christian, but we don't know that. Plus at the time the Scriptures were written most men stayed home and did their work out of their homes. I don't disagree with you as to what a Christian woman's priorities should be to her husband and children, but I do disagree that the only way that can be lived out is by a woman staying home and not being able to enter the workforce. Some of the most miserable Christian women I ever met were those who felt forced into their role in their marriage and home. Don't you think that it needs to be a decision between God and that woman and not for us to dictate to them what their role in the marriage and home should be?

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:23 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    believer: By all means, yes. The family structure has been shredded in a large degree because of that. I believe it is God's will, according to His Word, that the wife be over the home. This is her kingdom and she works diligently to enhance and glorify it as best she can. You, my friend support her so she has the wherewithal to do that very thing. There is so many details of God's will to describe, which supports this reasoning, but because of our cultural indoctrination, we just can't believe God expects this from us. It's not bringing women into bondage, it, rather, liberates them in the Lord and makes for a God blessed environment.

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 2:27 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib, but you still haven't answered my question, is it your belief that the Bible teaches that it is wrong for a married woman who is a Christian to work outside the home?

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 1:35 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    star2: Apology accepted. Lydia sold purple before she was saved, but the Holy Spirit says nothing about afterwards. No one is saying that a woman making things at home with her hands and selling it is wrong, but is she making a career out of it? We can't determine that from the info given in Scripture. If it was a career, I think it unlikely she continued after being instructed by Paul.

    Debra was a prophetess only. There was no government as we have today. Notice it says where she dwelt and how "the children of Israel came up to her for judgment" (4:5). They compelled her to go with them. Note: no one stated that a wife could never leave her home to do things. Judges only depicts a one time event with Debra. It doesn't insinuate that she made a career out of leaving day to day. We must not make a doctrine for wives having careers based on these two examples.

    As fro Dan. 4:32, God gave Israel a king, but it wasn't His will to do so. The people demanded it and they suffered because of it. When there is disobedience and obstinence by His people toward His ways, He'll give you what you want, but it will work to your demise and judgment. Sarah's endeavors are out of line with the Scripture. The price being paid is being seen in the calamity of the family structure and other sins we are confronted with as never before experienced.

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 12:49 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    believer: I'll say what I said before, look at the structure of the family and its destruction. Christians and Christian groups wonder why it is happening. It is happening because of what you are asking. If you examine the family today, the answer to your question is found there. God has designated an order in the home for the man and woman, and no matter how much we try to change it and make excuses for doing so, it will fail. It will be God's way or it will fail. We only curse ourselves and our society by being culturally and worldly minded. "Keeper of the home" - there is power and success in this instruction for the woman, man, children, and society. "Let God be true and every man a liar."

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:25 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    elbib, on her role as a mother, I think we may be making a lot of assumptions at this time with regards to her ability to be a good mother from a biblical perspective and a good VP. Plus, once again are we saying that moms are not permitted to work outside the home with regards to the biblical standards of being a godly mother or are they to ensure that while they are outside the home their children are being well cared for if indeed their biblical responsibility is to be good managers of the home? Because in the business world to be a good manager does not require one to do all the work but to ensure that the work is being done in an effective manner.

  • Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:05 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    elbib, I totally agree with your premise that it will be difficult for her to adhere to the biblical standards of a wife and to be the Vice President, but I'm not sure it can't be done. I would hope that her and her husband made this decision after much prayer and discussion and truly believe this is indeed what God would have them do. Plus, I know many Christian women who are in the public forum who are still from a biblical perspective in submission to their husband. Plus, do you believe it is totally unbiblical for a married woman to work outside the home? If not, would they not have the same issue to deal with as Sarah Palin and do you not see any of them doing this without jeopradizing their biblical role as a wife?

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:33 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    elbib - When you said that you were not perfect in being the NT married male believer that the Word of God requires of you I interpreted that to mean that you fail in some of the areas I mentioned. None of us are perfect even in what we espouse and make every effort to do. I guess you mean it in that sense instead of the sense in which I thought you meant it, that is, you don't do it at all. So I appoligize if I mistook what you meant by not being "perfect"; that is, that you strive to be perfect but like all humans you fail at times.

    Now, if you neglect to do what God's Word requires of you then for you to criticize someone else for not doing what you believe scripture teaches against then that makes you a hypocrite and I would say thast you need to get your own life right with God before you start criticizing or telling someone else to get their life right with God.

    I know that the Word of God instructs women to take care of the house, take care of the children, respect their husbands, and etc. so that the Word of God be not blasphemed (Titus 2:3-5). I also know that there were women who worked outside of the home; they actually owned their own businesses. For example, Lydia of Thyatira, a woman who had children at home was a seller of purple (Acts 16:14). Also, God chose a married woman by the name of Deborah who was a prophetess to be one of the twelve judges of Israel (Judges 4:4).

    I not so sure it is against the Word of God for Sarah Palin to be in politics. According to scripture God puts in power who He wants (Daniel 4:32). Sarah Palin was elected to city council, the Mayor of Wasilla, and the Governor of Alaska. She couldn't have won those elections if it wasn't God's will for her to do so. Who is to say it isn't God's will for her to be the VP of the GOP ticket? It would not be out of line in regard to scripture.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:44 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    star2: I don't know what you are talking about. You need to go back to 3:26PM and 3:32PM and read. Never was any admittance made at any time.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:41 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    believer: I'll start with the submission of the wife. I hope you will turn to the Scripture as you read this so I don't have to type them out.

    Eph. 5:22-24 Paul says in "everything" the wife is to subject herself to her husband even as the church is subject to Christ in everything. As God told Eve, Gen 3:16 "and thy desire shall be to thy husband." Paul stated to the Colossians that "it is fit [her duty and agreeable to the will of God] in the Lord." See also 1Pet. 3:1-7. If Sarah becomes VP, who will she be subject to? Where will her allegiance be focused? Will it be to Todd, McCain, or as a servant to the country? If Todd decides at anytime he does not like a situation for her or her company of men, which she will be surrounded by, what authority will he have? Your a man, you can probably imagine what some of my thoughts might be.

    Titus 2:3-5 The key phrase is "keepers at home."
    1Tim. 5:14,15 The key phrase is "bear children, guide the house." Both of these imply stewardship and responsibility of the home where the children abide and are reared, "so the Word of God be not blasphemed." Can one really believe that Sarah can devote herself to these standards, while away, even now? Sarah will not and cannot always have her family with her as VP. And if she did, what a disservice to her children. Even the ungodly liberals are mocking her on trying to be a mother and attempting to do what she is. It is what is causing the family structure to be broken down, which so many Christians supporters of Palin decry. As Christians discount Paul's instruction of the proper family structure, they help destroy it. That's why the problem exists and can't be fixed. God's way is the only way for it to be healthy. I could say more. but I'll have to trust that you can see my point.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 9:03 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib - You have admited that you do not adhere to the scriptural mandates that the Word of God has placed on you as a NT married male believer. You have no right to judge others for what yourself will not do. To do so renders you nothing more than a hypocrite. Get the log out of your eye before you try to tell someone they need to get the speck out of theirs. Judge not least you too shall be judged.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 8:28 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    gumbo, so you interpret that verse to mean that a woman is required to stay in the home and not seek employment outside of the home and to do so would violate the Word of God and usurp the authority of her husband? So you are basically opposed to married women being in the workforce outside the home?

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:35 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    I applaud Sarah Palin for letting little Trig live and not killing him - good for her and her husband. However, I believe the Scripture is clear on what a woman's sphere of position and service is. It is being a "keeper at home" as Titus 2:5 states, "that the Word of God be not blasphemed." I Corinthians 11:9 says that the man wasn't created for the woman, but "the woman for the man." She's been given a position in which to obey and glorify God. Wheter she can make things work out for her family is not the point, since it is not the real issue for any woman; the issue is, what do the Scriptures command and will we obey. Thanks elbib for your comments - very refreshing!

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 4:08 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib, I do look forward to hearing your scriptural support for your view and my wife stayed home with our son until he went to college so I have no reason to doubt your statement with regards to your role in your home.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:32 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    believer: Yes, I have committed to and adhered to that standard in my home and toward my children for the last 20 years. You can believe me as you will, but if I am lying, then, God is my witness and He will judge me accordingly. Please be patient and I will gather Scripture to defend my position for you. I hope that you will be open to hear it and receive it. In our culture today, God's word concerning these issues are not easily accepted.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:26 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    star2: You have concluded wrongly. But, obviously you do not comprehend that God's word is not measured by my life, whether good or bad, but by what it proclaims. I understand that to critize someone else concerning the biblical conduct of their life, one must not be the same. However, you are unable to make a biblical argument. Therefore, I will have to move on and converse with any that may want to debate the issue from Scripture.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:53 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    elbib, please show me scripture that says women are commanded to stay home and not be in the workplace? And do you adhere to that standard in your own home?

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:49 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    elbib - You made these comments to believer

    "believer: Are you basing your argument on Scripture or the ideology of our culture? And why do you say "mom has to be away?" Mom doesn't have to be away, mom choses to be away. Again, what does Scripture say about a woman's place in the home and the role of her husband? Or is it that Scripture isn't relevant when you don't want it to be. This is the contradictive aspect of Christians that I mentioned in the beginning, which I am accused of being hateful for. You are arguing for a cultural worldly mindset, not God's Word."

    First of all you are wrong that Sarah is away from her baby Trig. He and his big sister Bristol are with Mom on the campaign trail. Secondly, you are judging Sarah for not following the biblical standards set forth for married women with children. Unless you are following the biblical mandates for NT married male believers then you have no right to judge another. So, if you are failing to live up to what the Word of God requires of you then you are a hypocrite. Based on your comments to me I conclude that you are failing somewhat in this area. Therefore, I say to you, "Get your own house in order before you try to say what someone else should do or should be doing."

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:30 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    star2: I didn't know that the value of truth, in God's Word, rested upon my perfection in it. Are you insinuating that if I happen to fail in any of these attributes, which you have demanded of me to uphold for my arguement to be valid, it would mean, then, God's Word should be disregarded by all and in all things? Must I be perfect to declare what the Bible says? If I answer positively to all of your questions, would you, then, agree with me in my assertion concerning Sarah as a wife and mother to her baby and other children? Or would you convince yourself that I'm a liar? If the Word of God is not used to measure your life, then, how do you measure it? Based on the lives of others and what they think? It's a good thing that Noah didn't! But, if you are a Christian and believe God's Word to be true, then, it is that Word you will embrace, even against all that think otherwise. Again, I'm waiting for those who have opposed or will oppose my assertion to argue your opposition from the Word of God.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:48 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    For an insight into Sarah Palin's integration of family and work read the following:

    Sarah Palin: Mother and First Female Vice President (Pictures, Children, Parenting)

    http://parentingfreedom.com/2008/09/03/sarah-palin-mother-and-first-female-vice-president-pictures-children-parenting/

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:16 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib - I am assuming that you are a NT male believer in the Lord Jesus Christ.

    Does your wife work outside the home? Are you the sole provider for your wife and family? Are you the spiritual leader of your home? Do you make an effort to help your wife be all that God wants her to be? Do you take the time to be a part of your children's lives? Help them with their homework? play ball with them or attend their games? Pray for them and with them? Teach them the Word of God? Do you listen to their thoughts, worries, concerns? Do you know who their friends are? Do you teach your son by example and by word how he should treat people, how to treat a woman, and etc.? Do you show and tell your daughter how a man should treat her?

    How well do you measure up to what you should be as a NT believer in the Lord Jesus Christ?

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:01 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib - Mom isn't away from her son Trig nor her oldest and pregnant daughter Bristol. Both are with her on the campaign trail.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:13 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    believer: Are you basing your argument on Scripture or the ideology of our culture? And why do you say "mom has to be away?" Mom doesn't have to be away, mom choses to be away. Again, what does Scripture say about a woman's place in the home and the role of her husband? Or is it that Scripture isn't relevant when you don't want it to be. This is the contradictive aspect of Christians that I mentioned in the beginning, which I am accused of being hateful for. You are arguing for a cultural worldly mindset, not God's Word.

  • Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:08 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Little Trig goes verywhere his mom goes on the campaign trail. His big sister Bristol travels with the both of them and is the baby sitter when Mom is campaigning.

  • Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:15 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    elbib, babies aren't allowed on Air Force 2? What makes you thin she's not going to have the little guy with her? Plus, are you a sexist and don't believe his Dad could properly care for him in his mother's absence? Or how but his siblings pitching in a taking care of him while his Mom has to be away and can't take him with her? There are a number of healthy viable options to make sure he is well taken care of, but once again you make the assumption that he will not be allowed to accompany his Mom when she is traveling.

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