On the Selection of Rick Warren for Obama's Inauguration

inchristus »

Mon Dec 29, 2008 6:05 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

Believers everywhere should be Inaugurating Purpose Driven R-E-S-P-E-C-T as I said @ http://inchristus.wordpress.com/2008/12/18/inaugurating-purpose-driven-r-e-s-p-e-c-t/

Daniel Paul »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 9:07 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

"African-Americans will finally vote on the side of justice."

And they did when they passed Prop. 8.

DelightntheLord »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 8:12 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

Besides giving a few people more 'rights', why should society embrace same-sex marriage?

Other than the voting public are tired of hearing the homosexuals cry about it?

what good overall to society for same-sex marriage?

I can understand the value of marriage as we are all familar with, because it takes marriage to make a family which is the foundational to our existence.

what does homosexuality do for society? What does it add? Why should it be considered a right?
what contribution can they offer to society that they need the institution of marriage to fulfill as far as a purpose?

would this institution of same sex marriage be equal to traditional marriage, which is foundational to our existence?

How could this be? Homosexual marriage does nothing but please it's own and yet some want to define it worthy of the term 'marriage'?

That would make it an undeserved right not equal rights.

Granting special undeserved rights to a small minority will impede other's rights;
One example; parental rights and the right to influence our children's morality without government interference via secular, biased, politically correct public school system.
The right to have a say in what curricula is used in our taxpayer supported educational system to keep our children un-indoctrinated with every trend that comes into vogue.
Undeserved rights in view of the nesessity of changing the entire way marriage is known worldwide since the beginning of time. Redefining a whole institution to please a small but vocal group and changing it to mean what?

Making it meaningless? No purpose, no societial value, just an elected activity?
These are not equal rights sought, these are undeserved rights enforced through judicial tyranny.

Who should have SUCH RIGHTS?

mtgburrell »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 1:51 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

It may be slow, but (even though the civil rights movement gay rights movement are NOT exactly the same thing) African-Americans will finally vote on the side of justice. Some may never overcome the prejudice they learned at church about gay people.....but, I assure you, their children and grandchildren will help the homosexuals "overcome" discrimination. It's a done deal, really. I hope you (and I, too, for that matter) can live lives where gay right snever trampled on your rights (and my rights). Frankly, I think you and I are safe on that score.

mtgburrell »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 1:45 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

believer, that's not so much a "problem" as it is a "stage." When African-Americans do not have a clear candidate to vote for on the ballot, they will not turn out in such huge numbers. The black church is famously uneasy about homosexuality, but - with the help of leaders like Coretta Scott King and Barack Obama, they are getting over it.

Daniel Paul »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 11:52 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

GrafFred: There is a confusion created because there is "emergent' and "emerging". There is a great difference between the two even though the names sound the same.

Emergent theology (which Saddleback does NOT hold to) is a blending of humanism, Marxism and Christianity. It holds that the Bible has errors because it was written by the hand of man and that only the interpretation of the principles is correct.

Emerging theology, on the other hand, is taking the true gospel as written in the Bible to people in a way they can understand and apply to their lives. It holds that the Bible is without errors being inspired by God.

Emergent = I decide what is right.
Emerging = God decides what is right and I trust Him.

Daniel Paul »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 11:01 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

GrafFred...you got wacked! If you are doing the copy and paste you will want to replace the ",' and ... when you post. Many programs like MS Word use a short hand when it comes to these sorts of things which mean something different in "webeezzee".

GrafFred »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 10:44 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

Daniel Paul: Rick Warren is very supportive of “the emerging church.” This is what he wrote in a foreword for Dan Kimball’s book, The Emerging Church: Vintage Christianity for New Generations --

This book is a wonderful, detailed example of what a purpose-driven church can look like in a postmodern world. My friend Dan Kimball writes passionately, with a deep desire to reach the emerging generation and culture. While my book The Purpose-Driven Church explained what the church is called to do, Dan’s book explains how to do it with the cultural creatives who think and feel in postmodern terms. You need to pay attention to him because times are changing.

It is true over the past decades many trends have come and gone. As Warren stated in the foreword of Kimball’s book:

As a pastor, I’ve watched churches adopt many contemporary styles in worship, programming, architecture, music, and other elements. That’s okay as long as the biblical message is unchanged. But whatever is in style now will inevitably be out of style soon, and the cycles of change are getting shorter and shorter, aided by technology and the media. New styles, like fashions, are always emerging.

Not all these trends have been based on sound biblical doctrine. In fact the reason many of these trends occurred was because Christians were vulnerable to “winds of doctrine” that had no biblical basis.

According to the Bible, in last days these winds of doctrine will be “doctrines of demons” that will influence Christians to fall away from the truth and accept ideas that “tickle their ears.”

Rick Warren is not only supportive of the “emerging church,” he believes that it is exactly what is required at this time. He believes this is what “the purpose-driven” church that he founded will become in the “postmodern world.” He notes:

In the past twenty years, spiritual seekers have changed a lot. In the first place, there are a whole lot more of them. There are seekers everywhere. I’ve never seen more people so hungry to discover and develop the spiritual dimension of their lives. That is why there is such a big interest in Eastern thought, New Age practices, mysticism and the transcendent.

Further, he explains what the “emerging church” must do in order to emerge:

Today seekers are hungry for symbols and metaphors and experiences and stories that reveal the greatness of God. Because seekers are constantly changing, we must be sensitive to them like Jesus was; we must be willing to meet them on their own turf and speak to them in ways they understand.



Now, let’s follow Rick Warren’s line of reasoning through to its logical conclusion based on the idea the world is hungry for an Eastern worldview, the New Age, mysticism and spiritual enlightenment. If it is necessary to meet these “spiritual seekers” on their turf, wouldn’t that require Christianity to become more New Age and mystical?

believer »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 9:28 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

mt, the problem is that the people in California voted overwhelmingly for Obama and yet they passed Proposition 8.

ComeLordJesus »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 9:26 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

Rick Warren's writings and ministries has never sat right with my spirit. When all the rave was going on about purpose driven life, I honestly tried to read it and like it, same thing with celebrate recovery. I am in the recovery ministry but we don't use Rick's material. Listen, we are in the beginning of the end here. When we, as believers, study the Word, it should not be for the purpose of gratifying our own self-seeking motives (to prove others right or wrong) it is to move towards Truth closer every day. IF what is going on around you doesn't feel right in your spirit, it probably isn't so go to the Word. We are supposed to be Lights to a dark world. Jesus said he brings a Sword, not peace. Be careful, be very careful. This thing with Rick Warren and Obama does not surprise me at all. Peace peace. It's not real. Open your eyes wide, study the Word, the harvest is plentiful, believe me, there are so many people really searching, let's not be guilty of giving them a false gospel as Rick Warren has done. I'm not his judge or judging him. Only God does that. I am speaking the truth. You can bash me for it, true believers are going to be really getting bashed and called all kinds of things in these times. Didn't Jesus warn us of this? We need to find each other.

mtgburrell »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:53 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

That was not such a good answer. What I meant was: Until people really begin to think about an isssue, they just vote the old ways they are "set in." Personally, it would be more pleasant if these gay people just would not be so demanding. But I can see that they are sick of not having full rights, so I guess I can go along with their campaign. (As far a Jerry Brown, I DO think he is violating the spirit, at least, of the oath of his office - but I think that, when history is written, he wants to have been on the winning side, like an early American patriot who defied the laws of England. He can see how this particular debate will end.)

mtgburrell »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:46 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

believer, for the same reason that my people in the 1960s would have voted to keep white and colored water fountains in our city. Sometimes the courts have to step in. Still, this recent action on the part of Jerry Brownin CA seems to me to violate his oath of office.

steveh20 »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 5:19 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

Did Richard run out of time or ink?

believer »

Sun Dec 28, 2008 12:13 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

mt, if so many regular folks are asking that then why have so many states passed similar propositions?

Daniel Paul »

Sat Dec 27, 2008 10:32 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

"emergent ch_rch leader would represent those that adhere to baselines pincipals"

I think you've got your wires crossed. Emergent theology is not what Saddleback holds to. In fact, our church which is patterned after Saddleback has a Calvanist for a Pastor. He gets up to preach right after the rock 'n roll band....

You will find their theology (short version) at the following link:

http://www.saddleback.com/flash/believe.html

which has a link for the full version.

mtgburrell »

Sat Dec 27, 2008 9:04 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

"It also indicates that the president-elect is not buying the radical homosexual activists' argument that anyone who opposes them on the gay marriage issue should be ostracized as a bigot."

True, except that we all know where Obama's big-tent philosophy will take him on the gay marriage issue. The anti-gay-marriage fight is, we might as well say, over. Prop 8 will do for California and the entire US what Anita Bryant did for South Florida. Now, so many regular folks are asking, "Do I really care if THOSE two people want to get married?"

mtgburrell »

Sat Dec 27, 2008 7:54 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

Both Land and Obama are correct. We all know - or suspect - that Obama's statement that he does not support "gay marriage" is just a way to buy time (and votes) in the 2008 election. Unfortunately, people who support Americans' right to marry whomever they choose had to listen to our candidate make such a statement - because we knew what a fury (and a distraction from real issues) would have been made by the religious right if Obama and Biden stated how they really felt about this issue. To me, this is the closest Barack Obama came to "lying" during the election. But it was a lie worth telling. He got elected.

believer »

Sat Dec 27, 2008 5:55 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

graf, please cite your source for saying Warren believes all roads lead to God?

GrafFred »

Sat Dec 27, 2008 5:23 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

Would that the selection criteria would have included more Biblical tests. Hard to fathom how an emergent ch_rch leader would represent those that adhere to baselines pincipals. Easy to understand how Warren's "all roads lead to GOD" approach would be acceptable to a Wright disciple.