Methodist Women Seek to Pastor Large Churches

By Rose French|Associated Press Writer

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The Rev. Patricia Farris, 57, who has been senior pastor of the 1,200-member First United Methodist Church of Santa Monica, Calif., for 11 years, said qualities associated with male leadership typically are "emphasis on the leader being the one who casts the vision and leads the way, that this is the direction we should take."

"Women can do this too, but we lead in other ways that are more collegial and cooperative," she said. "Women are more inclined to say 'Let's discern this together.'"

In September, women who lead United Methodist churches with more than 1,000 members gathered in Nashville as part of the Lead Women Pastor Project to work on supporting clergywomen who lead large churches, researching their leadership styles and establishing a mentoring program for women who have the potential to serve such churches.

Women and men pastors who lead large United Methodist churches are being asked to complete a survey, which includes questions about leadership styles, pastors' salaries, demographics of their church and community and what kind of challenges and conflicts they face. The results of the survey are slated to be released sometime in the spring.

Project director Park said there's also an online study program for participants, where women can discuss the issue and recommend reading material on the subject.

"The present culture as a whole demands gender inclusivity," Park said. "Because of this demand, the church needs to develop some tools to help these female leaders to function effectively as religious leaders in this tremendous pluralistic and inclusive global context."

"Politically, women are rising in society. Why not in the church too?"

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FullGospel »

Wed Sep 16, 2009 2:39 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 0

Pastor Rose, you said...
May God help us recognize all his people as part of his royal priesthood!

There are three levels of priesthood in Old Testament Judaism and New Testament Christianity.
1. The High Priest
2. The Ministerial Priesthood
3. The Priesthood of all Believers

We are all part of 3. The Apostles and their successors are number 2. Jesus took the place of 1. Scripture agrees with you on number 3.
FullGospel »

Wed Sep 16, 2009 2:35 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 2

There are two Scriptural problems with a female being in the role of a Pastor.

The first is that Jesus is the bridegroom, His Church the bride. When Jesus said to His Apostles to do "this," they became priests forever in the order of Melchizidek, just as Jesus was (Psalms 110:4). When the bridegroom and the bride are both female, you know what you have...

Second, Paul said he became our Father in the Gospel, 1 Cor. 4:15, then he handed his office down to others and so it has gone to our present day. When a Father is female you have another oxymoron presented as truth.

I wish we could just let God be in control. It would go so much better for all who call themselves Christian.
danpat1_2000 »

Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:13 am Agree: 1 Disagree: 1

"and more than 50% of the world is female, how can we honestly deny females the opportunity to represent Jesus to the world? I do not have a problem with a female pastor..."

Following Jesus' example for one; He appointed 12 Apostles all men to represent Him when He founded His Church upon earth under St Peter. There was no one more deserving than His own spotless Mother Mary; however she recognized that it was not a role her Son intended for women.
danpat1_2000 »

Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:09 am Agree: 1 Disagree: 0

"It's not politically correct ..."

Politically correctness is killing our society.
danpat1_2000 »

Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:07 am Agree: 1 Disagree: 0

"especially considering there is no biblical support for it."

Whoa! For once right on.
Pastor Rose FMC »

Fri Mar 27, 2009 12:05 am Agree: 2 Disagree: 0

Anyone else find it incredibly jarring that this article is right next to an ad for Moody Pastor's Conference? MPC has all male speakers, and when you look further you find:
"As this event is designed for men in the pastorate, registration for the conference,
housing, or meals is available only to men."

May God help us recognize all his people as part of his royal priesthood!
marianne53171 »

Thu Jan 29, 2009 2:15 pm Agree: 4 Disagree: 0

I am a female United Methodist pastor, and God has called me to serve in this way, both through supernatural means (2 separate visions), through the Spiritual gifts and personality He has given me, and also through the confirmation of the churches I have been part of. I am humbled and blessed to say that some of the fruit of my ministry are people who have not been part of the church in the past who have converted to Christianity and who have become active church members in Kingdom service. I can certainly understand why people struggle with this issue, but I must tell you my own perspective - we should not use our Bibles to beat one another up, but instead agree to disagree in love and continue to serve the Lord with passion and integrity. One day we will know the details, but in the meantime, I can do nothing other than answer my call faithfully, day to day. I find this quote from St Augustine helpful: "In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; and in all things, charity."
Forgivensinner »

Wed Jan 28, 2009 2:43 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 2

ovid, the passage you refer to is referring to equal access/availabilty to the promise. Every man and woman can become an heir to salvation. This speaks nothing to the order in which His Church functions. Just as Christ leads us as the head of the Church so is man to lead not only the church, but his household.
ovidliving »

Tue Jan 27, 2009 10:03 pm Agree: 3 Disagree: 0

"There is niether Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female in the body of Christ."

To those who want to seperate people by gender instead of Spiritual gifting and God-given ability need to consider what it is in their own journey that makes them think they have the ability to judge whom God calls and whom God doesn't.

In my understanding, if someone says they're called of God to do something, then they'll be responsible to God for that understanding...not to me...definitely not to a bunch of bloggers on a CP site. Get a life guys.
ID4234 »

Mon Jan 26, 2009 4:16 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 1

Pastor Tim,
I did study the issue. I found no scriptural basis for female senior pastors, and in looking at the history of the early church, Eusebius records no female names as pastors of any of the congregations. Even in the United Methodist Church, through 1950 or so years, the church adhered to the scriptural dictates on pastoring. But then came the modernists who "feel" and believe their "feelings," not God's Word, reveal truth, and voila, female pastors regardless of 1 Timothy 3, Titus 1, 1 Timothy 2, 1 Corinthians 7;17, Colossians 3: 18-21. It was all predicted however. John described it in his writing about the Laodicean church in Revelation. We didn't have it wrong all those years and then got it wrong. We had it right and then decided to do wrong.
believer »

Sat Jan 24, 2009 7:11 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 0

pt, God does not deny women the right to be used of Him and in fact women Nancy DeMoss, Kay Arthur, and Beth Moore are three great examples of women God is powerfully using, the issue here is spiritual headship and the Word of God is clear, women should not have spiritual headship over a man in either the home or the local church. So if the position a woman is being considered for gives her that authority then she is not eligible to take that position. As for you not being qualified to pastor a large church, why not? My sense is because you don't have enough letters after your name which is a pretty lame excuse especially considering there is no biblical support for it.
DelightntheLord »

Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:32 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 2

Pastor Tim,
Your post sounds as if you value what your experience tells you over and above what Scripture says.
There is no Scriptural support for the church to decide it should train up women for leadership roles in the church, nor even have leadership over a man inside her own home. It is in defiance of very clear cut instruction from Paul to Timothy. The women we read about in the NT are helping to pastor not to Shepherd the entire flock; God created male and female for His purpose and women have been from the time of Eve, susceptable to being decieved by way of their emotion and that is why Paul wishes the woman would cover her head in church, a reminder of her helpmeet role. It's not politically correct to think there are gender differences and complementary roles for male and female...everyone wants to be the leader but not every man can be a leader and women should not step out of what God outlines in His word to have leadership over man.

"I am a small church pastor"
Then let me ask you, who is in authority over what you teach; who are you accountable to?
Forgivensinner »

Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:01 am Agree: 1 Disagree: 1

Hi Pt,
If a man is present in a family, do you believe he is the head of the household?
Pastortim »

Fri Jan 23, 2009 9:01 am Agree: 0 Disagree: 6

It's interesting...yet also dismaying...to read the comments concerning the issue of ordained women. I am a United Methodist pastor.....and I have experienced good and effective pastoral ministry from men AND from women, just as I have experienced crappy and in-effective ministry from both men and women. Gender appears to be no guarantee of, nor hindrance against, effective ministry. It's unfortunate that so many people in the Christian community (read that as universal church) neglect and overlook our history. In the early Christian communities, women were important and effective leaders and ministers. Don't take my word; study your history. It's only been since the early to late Middle Ages that women have been denied leadership or pastoral responsibilities in the church. But here's the question: if we truly want to be a "church" which represents Jesus Christ to the world....and more than 50% of the world is female, how can we honestly deny females the opportunity to represent Jesus to the world? I do not have a problem with a female pastor...what I look for more than gender is the spiritual center from which an individual empowers his/her pastoral ministry. And while I commend our UMC for at least addressing the issue of why women aren't n the largest churches, I will be honest and tell you my intense fear is this issue will become politicized....as we have a tendancy to do in the UMC. The issue is really not one of whether someone who is a women can lead a large church...the question is whether someone who is a women has the experience to lead such a church. At this point, we have not "trained" enough women to do that; that is our issue. I am a small churhc pastor; I am a white male; I am not qualified nor experienced enough to lead a large membership church...and I don't have any special right to "demand" such a position. I believe a better appraoch would be to deliberately train and purposely develop women to be able to lead such churches, not simply to scream and bemoan the fact and then "demand" that we place inexperienced women in positions where they will be most likely to fail because of inexperience, not gender.
Those are my thoughts; couple those with 50 cents and you might get a cup of coffee at the local has house.
DelightntheLord »

Thu Jan 22, 2009 2:32 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 3

Here is an example why women should not have leadership in the Church: This is a CP story titled: "Minister to Face court for wedding of lesbian couple":

The Rev. Janet Edwards will go before the Permanent Judicial Commission of Pittsburgh Presbytery on Oct. 1, facing charges of knowingly acting in defiance of her ordination vows and of the Presbyterian Church U.S.A.'s Constitution when she performed the same-sex ceremony, according to the Presbyterian News Service.

"Knowingly acting in defiance, contrary to the Word of God with willful and deliberate violation" Janet Edwards repeated Eve's defiance of God.
DelightntheLord »

Thu Jan 22, 2009 2:08 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 2

"....but lingering discrimination..."

UH...is that a reference to the WORD of God?

It was Eve who was deceived by Satan in the Garden and Adam followed Eve's example.
This is the moment of the Fall of man, we should not lose this context that woman was created out of the rib of man, making man head over the woman. This is the created order and is maintained by Paul's letters instructing the Churches ministry here on earth.

It is an error to disregard God's original design just because we are so-called 'enlightened' 21st Century Americans who have drifted away from the Written Word and have drifted into prevailing cultural beliefs about hierarchy, beliefs about Creation and truth being relative and no longer absolute.
Woman serve best where God has gifted them and there is plenty of work to be done by women in service to Christ other than leadership, which must be carried out in obedience to God's created order and not in opposition to it.
Topekan »

Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:23 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 0

All Christian believers, male and female, are members of a royal priesthood of believers. The distinction is an important one, because the Jewish priests (particularlly the high priest) offered the sacrifices to God for the forgiveness of sin. Jesus made us all priests, able to go to God directly for forgiveness.

Christian Priests are unbiblical, as are Female Christian preachers.
believer »

Thu Jan 22, 2009 8:41 am Agree: 1 Disagree: 0

Once again the issue is not about a title, but rather as to whether or not the person in a specific position automatically has spiritual headship over men, if they do simply by virtue of that position, then God's Word is clear, women should not be placed in that position.
cowboyfan88 »

Thu Jan 22, 2009 8:04 am Agree: 0 Disagree: 1

Just another disregard for scripture, ignoring God's word.
rolln4him »

Wed Jan 21, 2009 9:11 pm Agree: 3 Disagree: 6

Women as pastors. This is not a Biblical teaching, therefore they can have their largest pulpits - pulpits of Satan!
msnchris70 »

Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:52 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 0

I;ll restate. IN the bible as Marikya pointed out there were women who were "Helpers", but they were not the ministers. Only men were called to be ministers and be leaders over men.

Women are invaluable, and the more they serve God's people how God wants the better we all serve the people.
Marikya »

Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:25 pm Agree: 2 Disagree: 0

Were Nympha in Col 4:15, Pricilla (mentioned first) in Acts 18:26 and Romans 16:3 and Junias in Rom16:7 named among the apostles and in the Old Testament, Deborah in Judges 4:4 who is named as a prophetess/judge all of the Devil, or are we side-stepping the basic truth that anyone who God appoints (male or female) and is totally dedicated to Him can be used for His glory. It is also true that anyone who aspires to such an office be very sure that it is the Lord's calling and not just a desire to hold an office. It is a very heavy thing to be a leader in spiritual affairs and it cannot be carried out without God's anointing, grace, and daily commitment to prayer and intimacy with Him.
msnchris70 »

Wed Jan 21, 2009 3:52 pm Agree: 3 Disagree: 5

This all follows a consistent patern. They desire an office of "Priest" that is not allowed for them and now they demand to run large churches.

This is not of God, but the Devil. Notice if we use correct language that a woman co not be a Priest, but a Preistess which is Pagan. They truly cannot be called Priests for many reasons, let alone Jesus never called any women to be ministers only men.

Women have equal dignity to men, but we are not the same and God gave us different gifts to serve God. When a women demands more than what is due to her by God's Word, then she has the devil as her Lord.

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