Hate Crimes Bill Heads for Vote Amid Mixed Christian Reactions

By Michelle A. Vu|Christian Post Reporter

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“The Local Law Enforcement Hate Crimes Act is creating a special level of protection for homosexuals that many other vulnerable groups are being denied,” criticized Barrett Duke, vice president for public policy and research at The Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission of the Southern Baptist Convention.

Others that have spoken out against the bill, and did so again on Tuesday at the press conference, include the Traditional Values Coalition, Concerned Women for America, and the American Association of Christian Schools, among others..

Supporters of the bill, meanwhile, have their own backing of Christian leaders including Jim Wallis, president of Sojourners, and Dr. David P. Gushee, professor of Christian Ethics at Mercer University in Georgia. They argue that the bill does protect freedom of speech while strengthening the federal government’s ability to prosecute violent crimes motivated by bias.

“I would think that the followers of Jesus would be first in line to protect any group from hate crimes,” said Dr. Joel C. Hunter, senior pastor of Northland - A Church Distributed in Florida, who has expressed support for the hate crimes bill. “He was the one who intervened against religious violence aimed at the woman caught in the act of adultery. He protected her while not condoning her behavior.”

“This bill protects both the rights of conservative religious people to voice passionately their interpretations of their scriptures and protects their fellow citizens from physical attack,” Hunter continued. “I strongly endorse this bill.”

Others Christian leaders that support the hate crimes bill include the Rev. Dr. Derrick Harkins, pastor of Nineteenth Street Baptist Church in Washington, D.C., and Stephen Schneck, director of Life Cycle Institute at The Catholic University of America in Washington, D.C.

The hate crimes bill was expected to be voted on Wednesday by the House of Representatives. President Obama urged members of the House in a statement Tuesday to pass H.R. 1913 while also protecting the freedom of speech.

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Alockslee »

Sat Jul 18, 2009 5:59 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 0

Here is another HATE CRIME statistic report:

http://www.khou.com/news/local/stories/khou090705_gay-right-hate-crimes.1090bdac.html?npc

Houston doesn't have a Hate Crime Statute.
So it this another place where those against hate crime laws still claim there are laws on the books that adequately cover the LGBT community?
MORE TEXANS THAN EVER SUPPORT same sex marriage, so it seems maybe the pollsters aren't polling the people who are in favor of same sex marriage and reporting on it. For instance Rassmusen polls are quoted often on Fax but they almost never give the data that explains who, when, where the polls were done. they give little when they do.

A poll to be fair needs to accurate, taken from a realistic target audience, the data must be complete and provided with the polling results and not just something akin to 1,000 people polled, and then say the majority of Americans agree or disagree. the numbers for the polls on Fox are so insignificant and the people take them for granted as if they were a serious attempt.

Hate Crimes, looks like the facts are too much and too many to ignore as in this and other cases where did the existing law protect the LGBT person from injury and death? It didn't or that person would be alive today.

Wonder what church the killers attended as they had to be taught to hate gays and the most vocal groups and the ones promoting against equality are the fundies and evangelicals.

http://alockslee.blogspot.com/Where are the written words of Jesus?
TFR
Alockslee »

Sat Jul 18, 2009 5:56 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 0

Here is another HATE CRIME statistic report:

http://www.khou.com/news/local/stories/khou090705_gay-right-hate-crimes.1090bdac.html?npc

"Houston has an openly gay council member. Its city controller is running for mayor. A recent Texas Lyceum poll found that more Texans than ever supported same-sex marriage. Yet, it is still the largest city in Texas that doesnâ
Alockslee »

Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:50 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 0

Since I can't quote the article and have the full post show up I am forced to just post my comments:

In response: I cannot find anywhere in the Hate Crimes Legislation where it says "preachers or pastors can't speak about homosexuality"

Each time a fundamentalist or evangelical wants an example they use the most extreme and very often unconnected example they find. That technique is strictly used so that maximum shock and awe is elicited by the reader and/or listener and to make make the most impact as it is intended to incite the audience to ignoring the rest of the argument. this is nothing new fire and brimstone preachers have employed this for years and the scare tactics are pointed to cause the listeners to react in accordance with the person uttering the remark.

The time and effectiveness for scaring people is over as people are too well informed to be moved by these methods and their effectiveness are no longer useful. The people against the Bills simply want full license to promote individuals to act out violently and to intimidate those of the LGBT community, driving them underground or away.

If the fundamentalist/evangelicals are to be believed that LGBT is a lifestyle then they can convince those who attend their gathering to not engage in the conduct by choice. they don't need nor should be able to interfere with another person's life to control them or the community, since it is a choice people are free to listen to them or not and make choices. The fact that those against the Bills want to control everyone is the problem as they can't, don't have the power to do so and regardless of their efforts haven't proved their position that LGBT people aren't born that way as they would first have to accept scientific evidence as the basis to prove or disprove the point and that also is something that they can't deal with either.

http://alockslee.blogspot.com/Gobblygook Economics
Alockslee »

Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:49 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 0

Christian leaders mainly zeroed in on attacking the bill for endangering the free speech of pastors and any Christians who want to speak out against homosexuality. Under another existing law, if a person aids, counsels or induces someone to commit a crime, then that person is just as guilty as the one who committed the crime. It is going to cause, in a critical moment in U.S. history, a chilling effect in the pulpit where we cannot preach about biblical morality and sexuality,â
Alockslee »

Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:47 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 0

"Meanwhile, Christian leaders mainly zeroed in on attacking the bill for endangering the free speech of pastors and any Christians who want to speak out against homosexuality. Under another existing law, if a person aids, counsels or induces someone to commit a crime, then that person is just as guilty as the one who committed the crime."
â
LouNorWan »

Thu May 07, 2009 1:00 am Agree: 0 Disagree: 1

In Luke 17 in the New Testament, Jesus said that one of the big "signs" that will happen shortly before His return to earth as Judge will be a repeat of the "days of Lot" (see Genesis 19 for details). So gays are actually helping to fulfill this same worldwide "sign" (and making the Bible even more believable!) and thus hurrying up the return of the Judge! They are accomplishing what all of the Bible-thumpers couldn't accomplish! Gays couldn't have accomplished this by just coming out of closets into bedrooms. Instead, they invented new architecture - you know, closets opening on to Main Streets where little kids would be able to watch naked men having sex with each other at festivals in places like San Francisco (where their underground saint - San Andreas - may soon get a big jolt out of what's going on over his head!). Thanks, gays, for figuring out how to bring back our resurrected Saviour even quicker!

(saw above item on the web. reactions?)
Prophet »

Sat May 02, 2009 7:13 pm Agree: 2 Disagree: 1

"How long will it be before a homosexual tries to use this law because they felt threatened or uncomfortable in a church where homosexuality was being preached as a sin? I'm talking about where it was being preached only, not where anyone was being incited to violence or anything remotely like it."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Amen. The hate crime bill is a farce. The laws we have in place already are enough for anything that comes up.
Prophet »

Fri May 01, 2009 5:30 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 1

Flagged as inappropriate. show "The bill needs to be in place precisely because everyone will not only not stop hating but some will commit acts of violence based upon hate and designed to intimidate and terrorize targeted groups." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~``` Well....which is it? ChinYinYun says the hate crime bill is in place to protect people from hate. But you say that people still wont stop hating and committing acts of violence. Sounds to me that you don't think it's worth it either. Point is, the law and it's consequences, without the hate crime bill are detereant enough. If someone is not going to refrain from killing a gay man because it is first degree murder, putting a label of "hate crime" on it isn't going to put a damper on their actions. hide
ender »

Fri May 01, 2009 10:28 am Agree: 2 Disagree: 2

Do the people behind this bill think an additional law will really stop people who commit the crimes? If we stringently enforce the current laws and ENFORCE the sentences that accompany them, then you'll see a reduction in these crimes. No parole, no probation, just do their sentence. This law actually has the potential to intrude upon the freedoms and rights of law abiding citizens. Does the gay community really believe that someone will not try to use this legislation as a basis into what is preached/taught or believed by people who believe that homosexuality is a sin? Do you believe that the homosexual community doesn't have its share of zealouts as well? I truly believe that this legislation has the potential to infringe upon the civil rights of many.
How long will it be before a homosexual tries to use this law because they felt threatened or uncomfortable in a church where homosexuality was being preached as a sin? I'm talking about where it was being preached only, not where anyone was being incited to violence or anything remotely like it.
Rhi Bran »

Fri May 01, 2009 3:30 am Agree: 2 Disagree: 0

No prophet
The bill needs to be in place precisely because everyone will not only not stop hating but some will commit acts of violence based upon hate and designed to intimidate and terrorize targeted groups.
Prophet »

Fri May 01, 2009 1:52 am Agree: 0 Disagree: 2

Flagged as inappropriate. show "In reality this Hate Crimes Bill is practically to protect humans from hate..." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~` Ah yes. Once this bill is in place, everyone is going to stop hating. I understand now. hide
ChinYinYun »

Fri May 01, 2009 1:11 am Agree: 1 Disagree: 1

In reality this Hate Crimes Bill is practically to protect humans from hate, it's safety and needed!It's better for we christians leaders concentrate to build churches and spread gospel with actions(lovely,equal right,fair,peace-maker,redeemer,forgiveness,help,lead,contribute to society)more respect and honour by people.
Prophet »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:16 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 2

Flagged as inappropriate. show LOL. If things keep going the way they are, there will be so many groups covered under the hate crime that everyone will be covered, and nothing will have been accomplished. The laws, and their penalties, are sufficient enough without hate crimes. Coming from a person who is already covered under the hate crime, you can see what I think of it. hide
thepenitent »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:00 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 3

Why would a crime directed against a group be any worse than a crime directed against an individual. Both provoke the same amount of fear in the community at large. In each instance the victim's blood is just as red, their tears just as salty and their pain is just as real. The hateful motives of lust, greed, jealosy and envy are just as reprehensible as the hateful motive of bigotry. Thus, "hate crime" means some victims are more important and deserving of society's protection than others. It's a very bigoted concept really.
DelightntheLord »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 6:29 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 2

" I will admit however that there is some censorship on this site "

Only by those who have a log-in name, not by the CP staff, per se. They tried to monitor comments but it broke the 'conversational chain' by delaying the system, causing many commenters to leave the sight. I guess they opted for an open forum.
---------------------------
There is no doubt that Christian free speech is dwindling; first by banning mention of Jesus Christ in any public school, then through social egineering and promotion of political correctness and secular thought manipluation; media by depicting a false 'christianity' (Temptation of Christ, sit-coms, talk shows). Now by law and rule of force, for the "protection" of a special class of people. You can bet once a same sex marriage policy goes mainline and your children are taught routinely in public schools that gay marriage is equal to traditional marriage, speaking against homosexuality will come to the courts and ultimately be decided a hate crime. Unfortunately, that is the slippery slope with human nature; making laws has "unintended consequences" we may not see until down the road.

Our one party Government is posed on the edge of America's very demise both morally and financially destruction....a Just and loving God will have to judge our nation, we simply cannot keep running holding the bit between our teeth!
DelightntheLord »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 6:09 pm Agree: 0 Disagree: 2

"These are all mental disorders in the manual -- NOT sexual orientations"

Where do YOU draw the line and by what Judge your verdict?

The old "manual" listed homosexuality as such, before it got human rights.

God calls homosexuality unnatural to his design as well as all those other sexual behaviors that CAN be considered "orientations".
Prophet »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 5:05 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 2

Murder is murder. Assault is assault. Most assaults against gays aren't "to bring fear into homosexuals", it's because the assailant thinks homosexuality is gross and disgusting and they want to get rid of that gay person.
A person who kills another because he slept with his wife is true hate.
One life, or one group, is not any more important than another. I know the hate crime includes protecting people of religion, but the laws of the land are already fine without making one group more important than another.
Rhi Bran »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 5:02 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 1

ipwkego
Which of the thousands of pastors in America were denied free speech this month. The very website contradicts your assertion. And the Supreme Court just ruled against profanity on the airwaves. Your statement is factually untrue. I will admit however that there is some censorship on this site.
Rhi Bran »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 4:59 pm Agree: 2 Disagree: 2

No prophet, it stands for a recognition that some crimes are directed at groups with the intention of terrorizing the whole group. I pastor I know told me how his older brother, as a teenager in the sixties, used to seek out gay men, assault and rob them. He believed that the gay men would be unwilling to press charges and be outed. Growing up in Texas, derision was the most common form of hate directed at gay people and those who could be terrorized by bullies who called them gay. This was effective because society did not stand up for the rights of gay people. The implication was/is that gay people deserve what they get so the crime is of a lesser degree. Federal hate crimes legislation allows the government to step in when local law enforcement does not take action. Your statement is not prophetic but rather the opposite.
Prophet »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 1:44 pm Agree: 2 Disagree: 5

"The whole concept of "hate crimes" merely stands for the proposition that some victims are more important than others."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I tried using that argument with a pro-hate crime homosexual. Their well thought out rebuttle was "No it isn't".

In all actuality, it does make one person, or group, worth more than another. I guess if a person kills a gay man, then the gay man is more dead than the man who is killed because he was sleeping with his friend's wife.
Prophet »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 1:41 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 4

kego,

Isn't that the truth. It's only free speech if you agree with the policies of the current regime (sorry, I meant administration). Otherwise, you're suspect.
ipwkego »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:29 pm Agree: 4 Disagree: 3

You guys must be crazy! Freedom of speech is protected... as long as you meet the following requirements.

Pro-Pornography
Pro-Child Pornography
Pro-Swearing on TV
Anti-Christian and or Pro-Christian Bashing

(If your conversation or sermon meats the above requirements, please feel free to discuss them in public)

Sincerely,
Your US President
thepenitent »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:20 pm Agree: 1 Disagree: 3

The whole concept of "hate crimes" merely stands for the proposition that some victims are more important than others.
chicago24 »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 10:43 am Agree: 5 Disagree: 1

In this article, Gohmet claims that exhibitionism, voyuerism, necrophilia, bestiality and pedophilia are all "sexual orientations" that are listed in the Diagnostic Manual.

These are all mental disorders in the manual -- NOT sexual orientations.

The fact that these people have to resort to outright LIES in order to persuade others to thier position only goes to show that they have no valid arguments to support their position.

Purporting lies only negates any credibility they may have had and makes them look extremely foolish to lawmakers.
kylesantora »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 9:28 am Agree: 2 Disagree: 5

people are praising Obama as some great leader or one to change to future SO MUCH. well he will just not in the way you think. pushing this gay agenda so hard will ultimately lead to one thing. they are using our own laws to try to silence GOD!!!!!! and we are standing idly doing nothing. and some who call themselves Christlike are praising the fall of freedom and righteousness with a roaring applause and cheers. GOD PLEASE HAVE MERCY ON US!!!!!
SqueakyWheel »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:51 am Agree: 8 Disagree: 7

Flagged as inappropriate. show Right is wrong. Wrong is right. Our current state of cultural affairs. hide
LouNorWan »

Thu Apr 30, 2009 12:09 am Agree: 1 Disagree: 1

Flagged as inappropriate. show In Luke 17 in the New Testament, Jesus said that one of the big "signs" that will happen shortly before His return to earth as Judge will be a repeat of the "days of Lot" (see Genesis 19 for details). So gays are actually helping to fulfill this same worldwide "sign" (and making the Bible even more believable!) and thus hurrying up the return of the Judge! They are accomplishing what all of the Bible-thumpers couldn't accomplish! Gays couldn't have accomplished this by just coming out of closets into bedrooms. Instead, they invented new architecture - you know, closets opening on to Main Streets where little kids would be able to watch naked men having sex with each other at festivals in places like San Francisco (where their underground saint - San Andreas - may soon get a big jolt out of what's going on over his head!). Thanks, gays, for figuring out how to bring back our resurrected Saviour even quicker! (just saw the above on the web - lounorwan) hide
Furdy »

Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:38 pm Agree: 11 Disagree: 4

Actually the DSM has not included Homosexuality as a mental problem since the 3rd edition (aaages ago)

We are currently on the 4th, and the 5th is due soon after a typically long wait

Things such as pedophilia and voyerism which ARE mentioned in the DSM are categorized as sexually-based mental disorders, and not "Sexual orientation" - which refers specifically to what gender, sex, or mix of either, someone likes to get it on with.

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