Updated 11:59 pm.EST, Fri November 20, 2009

Society|Mon, Jun. 22 2009 06:01 PM EDT

Survey Explores Christian Faith of Homosexuals

By Audrey Barrick|Christian Post Reporter

The Barna Group on Monday released a new study that explores the faith life of homosexuals compared to heterosexuals.

Survey findings indicate that "straights" are more likely to be committed to their Christian faith than gays, lesbians and bisexuals.

Nearly half (47 percent) of heterosexual adults qualify as born-again Christians compared to 27 percent of homosexuals. Also, 75 percent of straight adults reported having made "a personal commitment to Jesus Christ that is still important" in their life today. Fifty-eight percent of homosexual adults said the same.

While six out of ten heterosexuals said they are absolutely committed to the Christian faith, only four out of ten homosexuals expressed such commitment.

Moreover, about half of straight adults said their life has been greatly transformed by their faith while only one-third of homosexual adults agreed.

Still, the majority among both heterosexuals (72 percent) and homosexuals (60 percent) said their faith is "very important" in their life. Majorities in both groups also identified themselves as Christian.

George Barna, who heads The Barna Group, said the survey results show that homosexual adults are not the "godless, hedonistic, Christian bashers" that some portray them to be.

"A substantial majority of gays cite their faith as a central facet of their life, consider themselves to be Christian, and claim to have some type of meaningful personal commitment to Jesus Christ active in their life today," he said in the report.

While faith may be important for most of the surveyed gays and lesbians, they do not prioritize it and tend to consider faith to be individual and private rather than communal, Barna pointed out.

"The data indicate that millions of gay people are interested in faith but not in the local church and do not appear to be focused on the traditional tools and traditions that represent the comfort zone of most churched Christians," he commented. "Gay adults clearly have a different way of interpreting the Bible on a number of central theological matters, such as perspectives about God."

Heterosexuals are more likely to attend a church service, pray to God or read the Bible compared to homosexuals. Gays and lesbians (42 percent) are more likely to be unchurched than straights (28 percent).

Additionally, heterosexuals are also twice as likely to strongly agree that the Bible is totally accurate in all of the principles it teaches. And 71 percent of straight adults have an orthodox, biblical perception of God compared to 43 percent of homosexual adults.

Among the similarities found, a small minority of people in both groups believe that Satan is real; equivalent percentages of the two groups feel they have a personal responsibility to share their religious beliefs with others who believe differently; and similar percentages believe good people can earn their way into Heaven through their goodness.

Survey results are based on interviews with 9,232 adults, 280 of whom identified as homosexual or bisexual. They were conducted between January 2007 and November 2008.

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  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 8:48 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:04 pm : 1 : 1 Flag Delete rolln4him: "Does America want to have gay pride type parades in all their cities". Part of the price of freedom is gay pride events in the cities. If you don't like gay pride events you might want to consider moving to Iran. I hear they don't even have gay people there, let alone parades! So the answer to your question is a definitive "yes" - if modern America didn't allow gay pride events it wouldn't be America land of the free anymore. Get used to it. hide

  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 2:03 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show The split boils down to those who are holding to what they have been told to believe and left, while those who aren't accepting the programmed line and able to think for themselves. There will always be some who make claims based upon their version of the bible, this doesn't mean their version is correct, nor do they even bother to read the original texts of the Old Testament which an exact copy exist called the Torah, which hasn't been changed since it was originally written. The big problem of those who split is currently homosexuality, and next it will be something else since those folks NEED to have a basis to draw upon and focus on. They would be better off focusing on dealing with the hypocrisy in the fundie Republican leaders who keep violating the very rules of family values and not one of them care because if they did those politicians would be kicked to the curb. The fundies and evangelicals need to move on and accept that their outdated rhetoric isn't working and have no place in America. They can then finish the complete break up and those folks may then be free to find churches into Christianity and not into fascist mind control. http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ Don't fear the truth! TFR hide

  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 1:57 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Where are the facts and sources for the claims in the article? It is always the same put up poll numbers, give percentages and yet not one of the fundie/evangelicals pollsters give any numbers of the people polled, the breakdown of those polled, even the questions of the poll are listed. When the facts aren't supported the poll is negated. So often fundies just accept what they are told and evangelicals can't help it as their conditioning prevents them even realizing that they have been duped. Well keep on with the polls as we are finding them oh so funny and even moreso unbelievable. http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ Truth and Reality!!! TFR 07/06/09 Christian Educators The school voluntarily settled the case and provided the rules under which it would abide. It could just as simply chosen to hold on and wait until the ruling was handed down. The School made it's bed and now has to lie in it. It is a proven way to make the School grounds secular, safe and to keep out religious zealots who want to convert kids to their way of thinking. The Public Schools of America are to be SECULAR and not involved in the promoting of any religious ideology. If people want to push religion then they have their church to do it and not have to go after the captive audience of children who are protected under the Constitution and having FREEDOM FROM RELIGION!!! http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ Truth, Justice and the American Way!! TFR hide

  • Mon Jul 06, 2009 4:36 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show bkgirl »Mon Jun 29, 2009 10:06 am Bottom line Mike and Dongard, as Christians the bible is the first and last word...... Therefore, homosexuality is wrong. Our Government and country, stating in "God we Trust" cannot seriously believe by condoning and rewarding homosexuality "God will bless American". We will end up like Sodom and Gomorrah. ----------------------------------------------------------- In response: first of all not everyone has the same ideology as you hold. The Bible is is not the first and last word with the majority of America. Your ideology does not dictate the SECULAR LAWS OF AMERICA and will never be able to be upheld even if you and others who hold to the same views get some ridiculous laws passed it will be dealt with and eradicated as well it should be since religion does not dictate to the secular state nor is the continuing forcing of America to convert to your religious beliefs going to be allowed. Secondly, while you may believe whatever you choose to, remember the Bible was written by men and no proof exists to refute that. The stories within the Bible simply relate morality lessons and there is absolutely no way to determine if the stories really happened as written and/or if they weren't just invented by storytellers to illustrate a point. To make a blanket statement that America is going to be suddenly changed is ridiculous as we have had several years to watch and find out what effects same sex marriage has had on "religiously sanctioned marriage" and no effects that you are alluding to or any who take your position can prove with any valid secular proof. So that argument is not even viable to mention. You need to remember that trying to validate your religious beliefs by making statements on behalf of everyone is demonstrating ignorance and stupidity. Please be sure when making such ridiculous accusations in the future to first consider that you can actually prove your position with accurate valid secular proof and not just reiterate yet another out of context and misunderstood selected verses from one of the HUNDREDS of VERSIONS of the Bible that you make claims that is the first and last word, when you can't even reconcile the contradictions between the different versions let alone show any valid secular proof that any of the contents actually happened. That is the truth about the Bible, whether you choose to believe in it or not doesn't change the fact it is not and has never been verified as fact. As for "In god We Trust" that came about in the 1950's and as a result from the communist scare and McCarthyism. Please take the time to learn accurate history, no wonder fundies can't deal with reality, it seems that it is just to difficult to accept reality when you all live in a fantasy existence and then get so out of sorts when you have to recognize your responsibilites! http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ Read the TRUTH HERE and relieve you worried mind from the fundie programming!! hide

  • Mon Jul 06, 2009 4:34 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Where are the facts and sources for the claims in the article? It is always the same put up poll numbers, give percentages and yet not one of the fundie/evangelicals pollsters give any numbers of the people polled, the breakdown of those polled, even the questions of the poll are listed. When the facts aren't supported the poll is negated. So often fundies just accept what they are told and evangelicals can't help it as their conditioning prevents them even realizing that they have been duped. Well keep on with the polls as we are finding them oh so funny and even moreso unbelievable. http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ Truth and Reality!!! TFR hide

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 3:42 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Where are the survey numbers that give the number of people asked, the number of what was asked, the numbers and locations of the poll, etc. As with any fundie based survey or poll the results can't be accepted since the polls, articles and materials are simply fabricated, has glaring omitted details and in most cases are filled with falsehoods and even outright lies. If the fundie polls are to be believed then they must do what real polls do and that is provide full facts to valid by sources outside those taking the poll to insure integrity. http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ The Blog that fundies fear hide

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 3:38 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Where are the facts and sources for the claims in the article? It is always the same put up poll numbers, give percentages and yet not one of the fundie/evangelicals pollsters give any numbers of the people polled, the breakdown of those polled, even the questions of the poll are listed. When the facts aren't supported the poll is negated. So often fundies just accept what they are told and evangelicals can't help it as their conditioning prevents them even realizing that they have been duped. Well keep on with the polls as we are finding them oh so funny and even moreso unbelievable. http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ Truth and Reality!!! TFR hide

  • Sat Jul 04, 2009 1:36 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Where are the survey numbers that give the number of people asked, the number of what was asked, the numbers and locations of the poll, etc. As with any fundie based survey or poll the results can't be accepted since the polls, articles and materials are simply fabricated, has glaring omitted details and in most cases are filled with falsehoods and even outright lies. If the fundie polls are to be believed then they must do what real polls do and that is provide full facts to valid by sources outside those taking the poll to insure intergity. http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ The Blog that fundies fear TFR hide

  • Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:44 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    "Hm,

    Have a good evening !
    ...and to you all!!"


    Whoever flagged that sure is anti-social!!!!

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:48 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    "Perhaps but most certainly a justification for verbal fireworks!"

    It wouldn't be any fun here without them.... :D

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 6:44 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Hm,

    Have a good evening !
    ...and to you all!!

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 6:42 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    HM wrote:
    So bucket, you think that Paul is saying that effeminate men go to Hell regardless of whether they are straight, gay or bisexual?
    ---------------------------------------------------------


    1Cr 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    effeminate is 'malakos' in greek.

    malakos mal-ak-os': soft, i.e. fine (clothing); figuratively, a catamite -- effeminate, soft.

    This is how various bibles translate the Greek words malakos and arsenokoites in 1Cor 6:9

    Version: malakos / arsenokoites
    *ALT- passive partners in male-male sex /active partners in male-male sex
    *ASV -effeminate /abusers of themselves with men
    *CEV -pervert /behaves like a homosexual
    *EMTV- homosexuals /sodomites
    *ESV - men who practice homosexuality
    *KJV- effeminate /abusers of themselves with mankind
    *MKJV- abusers / homosexuals
    *NASB- effeminate /homosexuals
    *RV- effeminate / abusers of themselves with men
    *YLT -effeminate /sodomites
    *NKJV -homosexuals (catamites) /sodomites
    *HCSB- male prostitutes / homosexuals
    *TMB- effeminate /abusers of themselves with mankind
    *NIV -male prostitutes /homosexual offenders
    *NLT- male prostitutes, / homosexuals
    *NRSV -male prostitutes, / sodomites
    *SV -sexual perverts
    *GNT -homosexual perverts
    *TNIV -male prostitutes /practicing homosexuals
    Darby those who make women of themselves, /who abuse themselves with men


    A catamite is the younger partner in a pederastic relationship between two males, which was a popular arrangement in many areas of the ancient world.

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 6:28 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Euphor, my guess is that the policy has changed since you did that. Try this: feel free to flag this post, and see if it disappears. Have a great evening! :-) hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 4:16 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show JeHo I could never figure out why anyone would flag you. I don't get it. HoMan- I have flagged only ONE post ever and that directly implied another poster was a child molester. It didn't disappear. How can you do that and I can't? hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:39 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show U4, just so you know, the deleting is probably not being done by moderators, but by other people posting in this thread. Anydbody can delete any post any time they want. All you have to do is click on "Flag." No justification is required or even requested. Most of us on both sides of these conversations have expressed dissatisfaction with the way this works, but for now, that's how it works. It's probably a hassle to change this in the software, and the people who run the site are (legitimately) more concerned with the news posts than with our comments. So I doubt we can expect any improvement in the near future. Probably for now the only option is to save your posts, or any others that you want to keep, in a separate notebook on your own machine. Then if they get deleted you can repost them if you like. :-) hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:29 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I wish I remembered what I had posted, lol.

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:24 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Yet the same Word of God identifies mankind as a unique and integral part of God's Plan, so much so that the Angelic creation focuses with intent anticipation on the display man portrays in his short life on earth.
    (Job 1:8a) And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, . . . .
    --------------------------------------------------------
    This life we live on earth is not for the entertainment of God nor is it an obstacle course by which mankind may achieve self improvement or refinement. There was already a heavenly conflict in progress when man was placed on the earth.
    (Ephesians 6:12) For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    The Garden of Eden was the perfect commencement of man's encounter with freedom to choose or act in opposition to God's stipulation. God was not astounded when man acted independent in regard to Divine provision, it was anticipated and necessary. Mankind would provide the final illustration of God's perfect character and provision. God's purpose in this earthly campaign is to bring an end to the rebellious disorder through righteous and just disposition of the dissidents that reject God's perfect perspective.
    (Daniel 9:24) . . . .to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, . . . .

    God bless!

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:23 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    This is one my posts that were deleted. I wanted to share this truth to answer johnzon's remark about GOd's unjust and unfair punishment for those who reject Him and His grace.

    DOCTRINE OF THE ANGELIC CONFLICT
    http://www.versebyverse.org/doctrine/angel_con.html
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    Why did God create humankind?
    ---to resolve the angelic conflict.

    The angelic conflict is the result of heavenly creatures being in opposition to God. This originated with the pride and fall of Lucifer (Satan), and resulted in all angelic creatures having to make a decision for or against God. Angels are now grouped into two Groups, elect angels, and fallen angels (demons). Their sentence has been passed but not executed.

    God has seen fit to vindicate His perfect character through a new class of beings, mankind. This undertaking will provide ample evidence of God's gracious provision to those who will respond and comply to His Wisdom and Integrity. Man's participation thereby shadows the angelic involvement and is evidence in support of God's just prosecution of the fallen angels. The conflict will only end when the full spectrum of time has elapsed and final judgment is administered toward all creatures.

    Honest examination of who and what you are, compels the soul to relate to the scripture.
    (Psalms 8:4a) What is man, that thou art mindful of him?
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    When the perfect standard of God's Word measures our human endeavors, we shrink into insignificance.
    (Isaiah 64:6) But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.
    --------------------------------------------------------
    con't

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 12:35 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Good one Daniel, Perhaps but most certainly a justification for verbal fireworks! hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 12:24 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    So...is all the flagging because we're coming up on the 4th of July? :-0

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:54 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show HEY, ATTENTION>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CP ADMIN!!!! Who the heck has the power to delete NINE posts at once?, Blink and gone, all at the same time! Somebody is abusing moderator privileges! Delete me, go ahead. I'll be back hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:35 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show What just happened? A half dozen completely inoffensive posts disappeared. All mine did was quote surveys recently showing the increase support for Gay rights like this one: Most Rhode Island voters favor same-sex marriage by a margin of 60 percent to 31 percent, according to a new statewide survey conducted by researchers at Brown University. A larger majority, 75 percent, would support a law allowing civil unions for same-sex couples. I suggested that support is inevitable. What the heck was Flaggable? hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 10:39 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show jehova << God knows what the future holds both for individuals and for nations.>> SO, your god would know even before a child is born whether its going to eternal paradise OR eternal torture. Seems to be abortion would be better than gamble on ones off spring ending up getting tortured for an eternity. If my wife or girl friend became pregnant, I would recommend an abortion so as not take a chance on my child ending up tortured for an eternity. hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 10:04 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Back to the articles original subject; SURVEY RESULTS a study less that 45 days old.... A. "Rhode Island voters favor same-sex marriage by a margin of 60 percent to 31 percent, according to a new statewide survey conducted by researchers at Brown University. A larger majority, 75 percent, would support a law allowing civil unions for same-sex couples." B. Texas Lyceum's third annual poll reveals that Texans support legalizing gay unions by a whopping 57% c. Pew Study shows if you are college-educated and under 40 years of age, 3 out of 4 support gay marriage. Over 60 with high school or less education and you are 90% likely to be anti-gay marriage. What does that indicate? That Gay Marriage is just the passing of one generation away from reality. hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 2:47 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Honest examination of who and what you are, compels the soul to relate to the scripture. (Psalms 8:4a) What is man, that thou art mindful of him? -------------------------------------------------------- When the perfect standard of God's Word measures our human endeavors, we shrink into insignificance. (Isaiah 64:6)-- But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away. --------------------------------------------------------- Yet the same Word of God identifies mankind as a unique and integral part of God's Plan, so much so that the Angelic creation focuses with intent anticipation on the display man portrays in his short life on earth. (Job 1:8a) And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, . . . . --------------------------------------------------------- This life we live on earth is not for the entertainment of God nor is it an obstacle course by which mankind may achieve self improvement or refinement. There was already a heavenly conflict in progress when man was placed on the earth. (Ephesians 6:12) For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. -------------------------------------------------------- The Garden of Eden was the perfect commencement of man's encounter with freedom to choose or act in opposition to God's stipulation. God was not astounded when man acted independent in regard to Divine provision, it was anticipated and necessary. Mankind would provide the final illustration of God's perfect character and provision. God's purpose in this earthly campaign is to bring an end to the rebellious disorder through righteous and just disposition of the dissidents that reject God's perfect perspective. (Daniel 9:24) . . . .to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, . . . . hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 2:40 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show DOCTRINE OF THE ANGELIC CONFLICT http://www.versebyverse.org/doctrine/angel_con.html *Why was man created?--- To resolve the Angelic Conflict. *What is history?--- An extension of, and conclusion to, the Angelic Conflict. *Why sin?--- Because angels and man have volition. God is not the author of sin, Satan is, Jam.1:13. *Why suffering?--- God is going to remove this, but right now this is Satan's kingdom and Satan cannot handle his own kingdom. The result is poverty, disease, war, death, etc. God's plan turns suffering into blessing. *Why the Church?--- Col.2:10, the Church Age is unique. The Law could not handle our Phase 2, but the filling of the Holy Spirit and the completed canon of Scripture can. This is the covert intensified stage of the Angelic Conflict. The Great Tribulation will be the overt intensified stage of the Angelic Conflict. *God's provision for us for the Angelic Conflict is spelled out in Eph.6:11-17. The angelic conflict is the result of heavenly creatures being in opposition to God. This originated with the pride and fall of Lucifer (Satan), and resulted in all angelic creatures having to make a decision for or against God. Angels are now grouped into two Groups, elect angels, and fallen angels (demons). Their sentence has been passed but not executed. God has seen fit to vindicate His perfect character through a new class of beings, mankind. This undertaking will provide ample evidence of God's gracious provision to those who will respond and comply to His Wisdom and Integrity. Man's participation thereby shadows the angelic involvement and is evidence in support of God's just prosecution of the fallen angels. The conflict will only end when the full spectrum of time has elapsed and final judgment is administered toward all creatures. hide

  • Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:24 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show DP, your "interpreting speed limit/closed sign" is a foolish argument. It compares something which is an absolute (speed limits and closed signs both mean something without a shadow of a doubt) whereas the Bible IS NOT interpreted by everyone in the same way. Even yesterday, two "christians" were disputing the meaning of "effeminate" in the Bible, both because they interpreted the word to mean something different. hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 11:33 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show It seems to me God would have known ahead of time there is no such thing as a perfect human unless programmed into robots. Humans would have to be programmed to be robot like to be perfect on earth or in heaven. --------------------------------------------------------- I'm glad that you mentioned 'GOd knowing ahead of time that humans are not perfect unless programmed into robots.' One of the attributes of GOd is omniscience. God's foreknowledge describes God's knowledge of future events, including future free human choices. In His omniscience God knows what the future holds both for individuals and for nations. He knows and sees everything in advance and His will is carried out in accord with His plans and purposes. Foreknowledge does not just describe the truth that God knew something would happen before it happened (although it is true that He did) but that He also gave prior consent to the happening. A common misconception is to conclude that God knew beforehand who would believe on His Son and then predestined those individuals for salvation. God's foreknowledge has an element of determinism in it because whatever really happens that God knows beforehand exists or takes place because of His sovereign will. THe question is, why did He creat humankind?. hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:59 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show believer << because of the sin of Adam and Eve our world has been corrupted by sin and the consequences of sin in all areas of creation and life and among the many negative consequences of sin we have disease and birth defects such as those you shared. >> Sorry believer, I think the A&E story and the sin thing and we are all now full of sin ,etc,etc is ALL BOGUS. Besides, there is no such thing as "perfect" behavior unless we all sit around in a vegetative state. The idea of a heaven where all humans are transformed into perfect little angels seems preposterous to me. It seems to me God would have known ahead of time there is no such thing as a perfect human unless programmed into robots. Humans would have to be programmed to be robot like to be perfect on earth or in heaven. Perhaps entry into heaven requires a lobotomy.. hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:17 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show HM, This one? --------------------------------------------------------- God is perfect. And being perfect He cannot be in the presence of anything that is not perfect. "You [God] are of purer eyes than to behold evil, and cannot look on wickedness." Habakkuk 1:13 --------------------------------------------------------- Just an anthropomorphism..... blasphemy? nooo :O) hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:57 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Daniel Paul wrote: "Effeminate (from dictionary.com): 1) (of a man or boy) having traits, tastes, habits, etc., traditionally considered feminine, as softness or delicacy. 2) characterized by excessive softness, delicacy, self-indulgence, etc." So again DP: you are saying that this verse damns effeminate men, not gay men. I am butch, and I don't abuse myself with men. So according to *you*, I'm off scot free, woo hoo! And you are also saying that femininity is self-indulgence. Why do you hate women? :-) hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:50 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Jehovahnissi wrote "God cannot" So JN you are saying there is something that God cannot do? That is blasphemy. :-) hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:47 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show bucket wrote: "God is good all the time....to HIS PEOPLE if He aint being good to you,,,,, do the math" God is good all the time to me. *You* do the math. ;-) hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:59 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show "many Christians envision thats all consumed with the affairs of mankind on a planet thats but a speck in a galaxy containing hundreds of billions of stars in a universe containing hundreds of billions of galaxies." You underestimate the God of the Bible. The Bible speaks of "cherubim" and "seraphim". Where did they come from? Why can't God be all consumed with the affairs of everything He created and all the beings He created? The reason the Bible focuses on us isn't a reflection on God. It's a reflection on us having enough problems dealing with our own little speck in a galaxy containing hundreds of billions of stars in a universe containing hundreds of billions of galaxies! As for the God of Christianity... Jhn 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life." Why don't you try getting to know who God is from His word and not someone elses. Your posts reflect a very poor knowledge of the Bible from a personal search. hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:50 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Effeminate (from dictionary.com): 1) (of a man or boy) having traits, tastes, habits, etc., traditionally considered feminine, as softness or delicacy. 2) characterized by excessive softness, delicacy, self-indulgence, etc. e femin (from feminine): refers to qualities and behaviors judged by a particular culture to be ideally associated with or especially appropriate to women and girls. Distinct from femaleness, which is a biological and physiological classification concerned with the reproductive system, femininity principally refers to secondary sex characteristics and other behaviors and features generally regarded as being more prevalent and better suited to women, ate :a suffix occurring in loanwords from Latin, its English distribution paralleling that of Latin. The form originated as a suffix added to a-stem verbs to form adjectives (separate). The resulting form could also be used independently as a noun (advocate) and came to be used as a stem on which a verb could be formed (separate; advocate; agitate). In English the use as a verbal suffix has been extended to stems of non-Latin origin Even in English it still means the same thing. As for interpreting what is read. As a teacher you know that is not always the case. Some things have memorized meanings. For example, I don't sit an interpret how 'closed' a store is if the sign says "Closed". If the speed limit sign says 55 then there is no action of interpretation but rather acknowledgement of the assigned meaning. I don't assign an interpretation of the word "closed" or "55" on a speed limit sign. I either accept the assigned meaning or there's gonna be trouble! hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:02 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    johnzon, because of the sin of Adam and Eve our world has been corrupted by sin and the consequences of sin in all areas of creation and life and among the many negative consequences of sin we have disease and birth defects such as those you shared. And while these are not necessarily the result of the sins of those children or even their parents they are the result of the sin in our world. And while God allows these things to occur in the lives of these children that by no means says that God caused these things to happen. The reality is we live in a sin soaked world and as God's Word says, the rain falls on the just and unjust alike to include those examples you gave, but that does not mean that it is the fault of the person or caused by God.

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:38 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    God in His love always wills what is best for us. In His wisdom He always knows what is best, and in His sovereignty He has the power to bring it about. He teaches the utmost importance of believing these principles, for if there is a single event in all of the universe that can occur outside of God's sovereign control then we cannot trust Him. If God's purpose can be thwarted, our confidence in Him is shattered.

    I myself am a living testimony of His goodness. Looking back, i realized all the pain and suffering were meant to bring me to trust in Him alone. THe first thing He taught me to do is to love my enemies...those who do you harm, continually, physically, emotionally,spiritually. I was stunned, of course. But that is His way...That was where He wanted me to start and to stay. TO forgive as He has forgiven me..and to walk in His love. It wasn't easy nor fun..It was a total mental attitude sin 'turn-about'. Yes, mental attitude sins are as bad as covert sins. As i walked in His will and trusted in Him, He slowly but surely, turned everything to good...He made me stronger more each day, and blessed me spiritually with His joy, peace and contentment. No money can buy that.

    Every trial that a believer faces is an opportunity to grow more in His likeness...His Divine nature , the fruit of the Spirit, as opposed to our sinful nature, and fcorrupt ruit of the flesh , Christ reigning in our hearts as opposed to self. TO fail to apply His principles means that the trial will always come until one one humbly yields and submits to GOd...in order that the righteousness of CHrist imputed in us will prevail.

    --------------------------------------------------------
    Psalms 34:18 The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.

    Psalms 51:16 For thou desirest not sacrifice; else would I give it: thou delightest not in burnt offering.
    17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.
    ---------------------------------------------------------


    GOD IS GOOD indeed!!

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:30 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show bucket << God is good all the time....to HIS PEOPLE if He aint being good to you,,,,, do the math>> Children born with diseases such as cancer, cystic fibrosis, etc. Why isn't God good to them. What did they do to anger God? There was a good church going family of five recently killed in a car crash, children were under seven, wonder what those children did to anger God so much? Do the math.... hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:25 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show jehova << you have your problem (proving GOd doesn't exist ) which is only your problem...so move on.>> I am an agnostic, not an atheist. There may indeed be a creator, but dont believe its the vengeful God that many Christians envision thats all consumed with the affairs of mankind on a planet thats but a speck in a galaxy containing hundreds of billions of stars in a universe containing hundreds of billions of galaxies. I'm sure you and bucket would like me to "move on", but as long as some Christians attempt to impose their beliefs on me (blue-laws, reproductive rights, end of life decisions, etc) I will be here. Have a nice day hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:31 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    johnzon » Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:12 pm : 0 : 0 Flag
    bucket

    << you have enough problems without engaging me...
    move on>>

    OK, I see, you cant come up with a good counter argument.
    ..............
    ready
    set
    go

    God is good all the time....to HIS PEOPLE
    if He aint being good to you,,,,,
    do the math

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:25 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    johnzon,


    You have made it very clear that you do not believe in God..so what good will discussing our faith be to you?

    Like bucket said...you have your problem (proving GOd doesn't exist ) which is only your problem...so move on.

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:12 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    bucket

    << you have enough problems without engaging me...
    move on>>

    OK, I see, you cant come up with a good counter argument.

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:10 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    johnzon » Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:29 am : 0 : 0 Flag
    bucket

    <<"GOD IS GOOD ALL THE TIME">>

    What does that mean exactly?

    What about this, doesn't sound so good to me:

    "I will sweep away everything in all your land," says the LORD. "I will sweep away both people and animals alike. Even the birds of the air and the fish in the sea will die. I will reduce the wicked to heaps of rubble, along with the rest of humanity," says the LORD. "I will crush Judah and Jerusalem with my fist and destroy every last trace of their Baal worship. I will put an end to all the idolatrous priests, so that even the memory of them will disappear. For they go up to their roofs and bow to the sun, moon, and stars. They claim to follow the LORD, but then they worship Molech, too. So now I will destroy them! And I will destroy those who used to worship me but now no longer do. They no longer ask for the LORD's guidance or seek my blessings."

    ...................
    you have enough problems without engaging me...
    move on

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:07 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    you lol because you can not understand...:O)

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:37 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show << That is GOd's decree to punish unrpentant sinners in hell.>> real nice religion you got goin there jehov.........LOL hide

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:53 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    That is GOd's decree to punish unrpentant sinners in hell.

    ....As criminals are put to jail.....

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:29 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    jehov

    You really didnt answer my question:

    How does the eternal torture treatment fit into that description (God is summum bonum, the highest good)

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:20 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "The Lord is merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in mercy." Psalm 103:8

    ...but, He must judge sin. So God decided that He would pay the penalty Himself.

    "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved." John 3:16-17

    God stepped out of Heaven, became a man (Jesus Christ), lived a life without sin (which you couldn't do), became the perfect sacrifice, and died on the cross for your sins (He died so you wouldn't have to). Three days later He arose from the dead proving death had no power over Him.

    God has set a penalty for sin but has offered to pay the price so you won't have to!

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:16 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogance of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible." Isaiah 13:11

    God is perfect. And being perfect He cannot be in the presence of anything that is not perfect.

    "You [God] are of purer eyes than to behold evil, and cannot look on wickedness." Habakkuk 1:13

    If God would ignore sin and allowed it continue unpunished then He would be compromising His own perfect standards! So the penalty for sin is established:

    "Your iniquities have ever made a separation between you and your God, and your sins have caused him to hide his face from you." Isaiah 59

    "everyone shall die for his own iniquity [sin]." Jeremiah 31:29

  • Sat Jun 27, 2009 11:55 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    << God is summum bonum, the highest good. >>

    How does the eternal torture treatment fit into that description??

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