With still little cooperation from ministries that have been asked to turn over their financial statements for investigation, Sen. Charles Grassley plans to send out another round of letters requesting that they comply.
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Grassley Asks Televangelists Again for Cooperation
By
Lillian Kwon
Christian Post Reporter
Fri, Jan. 18 2008 07:11 PM EST
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Copeland brags about being a billionaire to his congregation. I wonder who he's serving?
http://www.grassleyinvestigation.com
Is this Ministry worshiping Idols rather than the Lord Jesus Christ?????
BLASPHEMY (Arrogance, Deceit, Lying)
Why is blasphemy treated so seriously in the Bible?
BIBLE READING: Matthew 9:1-8
KEY BIBLE VERSE: At this, some of the teachers of the law said to themselves, “This fellow is blaspheming!” (Matthew 9:3, niv)
Jesus was accused of blasphemy. Blaspheming is claiming to be God and applying his characteristics to yourself. The religious leaders rightly saw that Jesus was claiming to be God. What they did not understand was that he is God and thus has the authority to heal and to forgive sins.
It’s easy to tell someone his sins are forgiven; it’s a lot more difficult to reverse a case of paralysis! Jesus backed up his words by healing the man’s legs. Jesus’ action showed that his words were true; he had the power to forgive as well as to heal. Talk is cheap; our words lack meaning if our actions do not back them up. We can say we love God or others, but if we are not taking practical steps to demonstrate that love, our words are empty and meaningless. How well do your actions back up what you say?
BIBLE READING: Mark 3:20-30
KEY BIBLE VERSE: But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin. (Mark 3:29, niv)
Blasphemy is a deadly sin. Christians sometimes wonder if they have committed this sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. Christians need not worry about this sin because this sin is attributing to the devil the work of the Holy Spirit. It reveals a heart attitude of unbelief and unrepentance. Deliberate, ongoing rejection of the work of the Holy Spirit is blasphemy because it is rejecting God himself. The religious leaders accused Jesus of blasphemy, but ironically they were the guilty ones when they looked Jesus in the face and accused him of being possessed by Satan.
Victims have the right to ask!
Exactly who does have a right to question Copeland about where the money goes? Copeland put on a exhalent performance at his latest ministers conference, visible at http://www.wittenburgdoor.com/copelandclips , in which has now gotten the attention of people all across the USA, and abroad. If I didn’t personally know better, one would actually think he cares about the protection of all his followers (partners),that pour money into his ministry. Requesting a summery of my mothers (Bonnie Parker) contributions, a long time partner of KCM, we like Grassley got little or no response. (Request viewable at http://sis359.blogspot.com/ ). If their partners aren’t entitled to this privileged information, even though they are funding this lavish lifestyle KCM has grown very accustom to, nor is the Senate entitled either, then who is? The IRS perhaps? Are the teachings of the Prosperity Gospel message being misconstrued? Do we, any of us, have a valid argument, or the right to ask for these records ? I believe with all my heart, we should let the ones affected most by this money making scam have a say in determining the answer to those questions..
“ I had a home“, “I had a life“, “I had faith“, “I had a family“, “I lost a loved one“, “I have no clue what the truth is anymore!” “I will never trust any form of religion.” these are merely a handful of endless testimonies coming to light nationwide. Ranging from all walks of life, their heartbreaking testimonies can be found throughout the web, yet inconceivably, victims are being labeled as fools, ignorant, and basically downright blind for not seeing the truth behind the Prosperity Gospels falsehoods. ” Being only human, our quest for health and wealth, regrettably does lead some in the wrong direction. Promises and guaranties, made by the Prosperity Gospel ministers, give people that have not obtained these blessings on their own, a second chance at achieving their goals in life. An important discovery I made while reviewing testimonies, revealed the fact numerous victims had very little knowledge of the Prosperity Gospels dark side. These unfortunate victims, appear to be equipped with only a small portion of the web of deceit these ministers weave. Knowledge, is the only discovery I found to be effective in this seemingly endless battle. Sadly for some our efforts will go unheard. God be with them.
The family of Bonnie Parker
sis359@gmail.com
Photo, before and after KCM,
http://picasaweb.google.com/sis359/BonnieParkerDiaryPhoto
Documentary Suffer The Children, exposes televangelists lavish lifestyles ,
http://www.wittenburgdoor.com/suffer-children
Book recently published by Sara Posner, also looks into these subjects,
http://www.amazon.com/Gods-Profits-Republican-Crusade-Values/dp/0979482216
to victor conedy - I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU! are these pastors tele evangelist above the law. they tell you to obey (god, authority - even how evil they are - & pastors) yet they are not practicing what they preach! WHAT A BUNCH OF HYPOCRITES!!
to tonkatweety - first of all, aren't the pastors/teleevangelist messengers of god? they should set the example in their pointing to sins & not break them. wouldn't it be hypocritical for them to say that it is a sin to love self, then they would enrich themselves? the point is they would say that tithe is used in the ministry of god, yet they have multi million dollar homes, luxury cars & jets - spending 'god's tithe' for them'selves' . also why would these messengers of god point to sin then justify the very 'sins' they are condemning others for by saying 'ye not judge.' are these messengers of god relying on god or are they relying on themselves. Men will LOVERS OF MONEY & that includes pastors/tele evangelist. their teachings are childish & immature because they have not worked & dealt with job loss, politics & asskissing at work, stress, & getting paid $7.50/hr. they made their own church a business, where the CEO is the pastor whose average salary is $7800/month.
It's written that none of us can know the hidden things of a man's heart. So I believe it is NOT for us to judge a man's heart whether he loves God or not - especially if we don't agree with their actions. God is the author and finisher of our faith and therefore He alone is the judge of our heart. He did give us the Word as a plumb line of truth to help us see if actions reflect him or not. And we need to go to the Word for answers to this. A lot of the prosperity Gospel is based in Old Testament text so those that preach it shouldn't have a problem with aligning themselves with the OT that describes the actions of what a Good Shepherd is in Ezekiel 34. I encourage you to read this entire chapter as it is eye opening. Paraphrased it says that Good shepherds feed their flock of the best first and then feed themselves, they search out the weak and tend the sick and lastly take care of themselves. A bad shepherd feeds himself on the riches of the land first as his flock scatters and is easy prey. To answer walking on Sonshine about accusing someone of thinking pastors should be poor - no - as long as they feed their flock first it's ok to be rich. Doesn't the Word sayin laying down your life is truly where you find it? As far as providing financial information to the government doesn't Jesus say render to Caeser what is Caesar's. Grassley isn't asking for 'God's money' he's asking for information to see if the financial seed God's sheep have sown is being properly spent. And why should we be surprised that this is an issue there have been money changers around since before Jesus. I'm thankful for the ministries that have come forward with the information and have proven themselves blameless before God and men such as it should be.
ALL Joyce Meyer books are solely under her name, not at all affiliated with her ministry...you can view all of Joyce Meyer Ministries' tax records etc.. via her website.
Wow! I REALLY, REALLY need some help on this issue. PLEASE, somebody please respond to this post soon and tell me how the REAL issue keeps getting overlooked? Let me make it simple: You cannot start a church (no matter what the philosophy) and have the church publish your book, distribute your book and then pay you royalties IF you have a tax-exempt 501c. Is that simple enough? It doesn't matter if that book is the greatest book ever written and saves the lives of millions of people, you still can't use your non-profit 501c to sell it and pay your royalties. You CAN donate the same book to that same non-profit organization and let the non-profit sell it and keep the money to be used for other projects. CAN YOU SEE THE DIFFERENCE?????? Read below for a more detailed explanation.
Most of the comments are based on pure emotion, either for or against. Are you aware that tax-exempt status is given to an organization from the US Government? Therefore, the US Government has a right to see that an organization continues to adhere to the rules that were used to determine the tax-exempt status. An organization gets a 501c BECAUSE it files paperwork and asks for the tax-exempt status. The paperwork states that among other things, that the organization will exist for the purpose of some community benefit and not for the benefit of an individual. Unfortunately, there are no hard and fast numbers which would indicate what constitutes "existing for the benefit of an individual". In the 1990's for example, the president of the Red Cross was receiving a salary of about $436,000 per year. Excessive? Maybe, considering that the President of the U.S. wasn't making that much at the time. In that case, the salary went up for review and it was determined that it may have been a little much for the circumstances. Those who pointed this out were not against the work that was being done by the Red Cross, but in order to maintain a status of "non-profit" the organizations main focus needs to be to the needs of a group of otherwise disenfranchised persons. Same situation here concerning the church that has applied for and enjoys the tax-exemption. No one is questioning that any of these churches are benefiting the community by feeding the homeless or by providing spiritual relief. The problem is, since there are no clear cut numbers or percentages which would reveal malfeasance, simple "appearances" is all one can go on. Lavish lifestyles of heads of non-profits are in fact a violation of the tenets and purpose for granting the tax-exemption. Taking this as an attack on God's people or God's work is naive and ignores the real issue. Also, gladly calling them all charlatans is equally juvenile. Victor Conedy
You preach it Bllrdncwby !!! I wholeheartedly agree !! Amen! Keep on Keepin on!
I have a question, how many people that complain about televangelists have brought half as many people to the Lord as they have? They make money, but how many of us knows how much it costs to produce and air a television show? I'll give you a hint, a lot. Now combine that with the fact that some of these shows air on multiple networks multiple times during the day. Perhaps if we were a little less jealous, and a little more grateful that the word of God is being broadcast (regardless of if we personally like who delivers the message) we wouldn't have all these issues. If they preach Christ, and Him crucified as Paul did, where is the room to complain? How often do you preach/witness? Let him without sin.....
I daresay I detect that some of you bloggers beleive that God expects pastors to take a vow to poverty in order to effectively serve the lost.. Were you there in the beginning of their ministries to see how they lived, sacrificed and still pressed on...Perhaps it is a jealous spirit that you posses... OR do you just choose to judge NOW because you live in lack...
I do not believe in the twisting of the Gospel by prosperity preaching.If a pastor has been called, are obedient to the Word, give of their tithe, and are seeing people saved, redeemed and discipled, then why should you or I write about all that we find fault in .. Perhaps you who are casting the first stone should GO, DO and preach the Good News and see how you can further the cause of Christ.. with your sour, legalistic, religious attitude, the lost surely would get you an earful from you ...ugghhh..Grace, Grace and more Grace..
to maranatha - why can't you see the picture that these people are living lavishly & all they think of is themselves. is it unsubstiated gossip when they have multi million homes, luxury cars & private jet? that is called greed & love of money while millions of people are dying of hunger, cold, naked & ignorant. are they preaching the gospel for a price or is it grace which means FREE! show me in the bible where christ charge the poor sick & hurting in return for healing & comfort! if these pastors/tele evangelist command us to follow christ, they should set an example not break it. HERE is where I see that their SELF is SIN!
One needs not follow Christ outside the camp to the Cross according to the feel-good messages meant for itching ears preached by the false teachers and prophets abounding on the popular stage today. We are apt to idolize the speaker and forget that God alone regenerates the heart of one drawn to Christ by His Word. In their blatant Scripture-bending fashion, these pervert the truth of spiritual prosperity into worship at the altar of mammon. Measure all by the Word of God. None who know the truth will have excuse before the Lord Who sees the heart. Mark and avoid those who teach doctrinal error (ROM 16:17), expose them (EPH 5:11) that deceive the hearts of the simple with fair speeches (ROM 16:17-18). Unity in the church must never come at the expense of her purity. Can you peacefully receive the expose' of a false teacher you have come to like? No one likes to think he has been deceived, but the one who gets upset, comes to the defense of, and makes excuses for the deadly errors of a false teacher has not laid down his idolatry of mere man. Repent, and the Lord will deliver you from spiritual adultery and the grasp of the enemy. Again, read about Eli and his sons. Also read Proverbs 24:10-12.
Brothers and sisters, I think we need to be very careful here whom we condemn. We know the Accuser of the Brethren is the devil himself. Note, I'm not saying that these pastors/teachers are all doing right in the sight of the Lord. What I am saying is, I don't know all there is to know about them. I have read accusations here, but I have not seen any clear evidence of these things. Are they then not slander? Unsubstantiated gossip?
I don't have the scripture right in front of me, but I remember Paul saying that he didn't oppose some people who were preaching the gospel even though he knew their motives weren't right - he said he was just glad the gospel was being preached.
Can we be glad people DO get saved by hearing these people preach? I am all for purity in the church and have often said that, but I fear we are in danger here of "biting and devouring" one another as Paul warned so long ago. Please, let's all search our hearts in the light of God's Word and ask the Holy Spirit to show us if there's anything we're saying here which is not pleasing to Him.
And I agree with whomever pointed out the fact that Joyce Meyer Ministries and Kenneth Copeland Ministries did in fact submit their financial records by the deadline. If nothing else, we can say they have not resisted authority in this situation. They are certainly not acting like they have anything to hide.
Perhaps we should all study Philippians 4 today.
SNAKES IN THE PULPIT- NEW BOOK EXPOSES THESE CROOKS
SUCH AS CREFLO DOLLAR, JOEL OSTEEN, T.D. JAKES AND EDDIE LONG
WWW.SNAKESINTHEPULPIT.COM
WWW.REUBENARMSTRONGSHOW.COM
Spotless before the Lord in their integrity? Read the Bible much? Copeland claims to be a god and that if he had known Scripture like Jesus--well then he could have saved mankind from sin. And Meyers claims she is now without sin. Read what John says about just such a one as this. Spotless! Stop judging by appearance and judge rightly. Read the Word for yourself.
It should say something about the integrity of the (2) ministries--(Joyce Meyer and Kenneth Copeland) that have moved forward with this probe.. they are spotless before the Lord in their integrity- filled, timely response.. They have submitted to authority.
Whatever each of us may think of the theology involved here, surely we can agree that this is a theological issue. It is a dangerous thing when the government starts to decide what is good theology and what is not. Please take a look at some of the good senator's statements, and you may decide that he is attempting to judge the theology of the ministries involved. Example: He says that Jesus came into Jerusalem on a donkey and that ministers should not drive a certain car (basically the idea of his statement). This is a U.S. Senator judging theology. Yes, we are dealing with income tax deductions for givers to particular ministries. But if the government begins to quibble about money spent on this and that by these ministries, where will it all stop? I suspect that this may be the stand of Sekulow, who may be concerned about the constitutional dangers of such actions by congressmen and their committees. Let me ask this: Where is the line one can draw between an acceptible car for a minister to drive and an unaccetible one. I assure you that my own family cars would be acceptible to the senator or most anyone else in this nation, but I do not believe we should let the government determine these issues. Here is the theological stand of the Constitution in our country: We will let people believe what they wish to believe, so we the people can believe what we choose to believe. How about letting the contributors to ministries deal with these issues. If they do not like the way money appears to be spent in a ministry, let them give elsewhere. Certainly, one can envision circumstances in which ministries can lose their tax-exempt status. But if ministries are, indeed, following IRS rules, then leave them alone. Change rules if you wish, but be very careful doing so to protect freedom of religion. I know some of you very much dislike the so-called "prosperity gospel," but be careful in supporting government attempts to control the Church, or you may be unwittingly find your own views getting government scrutiny in the future.
Compliance with tax laws? NO. They pervert the grace of God, steal from Him, steal from the flock, claim tax-exempt status and steal from the government, and the blinded-by-mammon element that knows nothing of sacrificial love (giving not to get) or the love shown in discipline and accountability, let alone anything approaching doctrinal Truth (oh no! the dirty "d" word!) coats them with "greasy grace". The heresies in their teachings are obvious to any who unselfishly read the Bible and take it in as the whole and finished revelation of the Lord our God. How long, oh God, how long? May Your will be done.
Read about the sons of Eli. Are these any less guilty before the Lord?
There may be legitimate constitutional questions that need to be addressed. If the committee is going past the constitution they need to be questioned. You cannt have our government go against it at will. The preachers have a right to question the constitutionality of this. Who are the people making the complaints? In many cases the people complaining are having problems with doctrine. if this is the provocation for the investigation that is wrong. We do have freedom of religion no matter how outrageous the religion is as long as it does not break other laws (killing, etc.).
I do not want my statements to be used to say that I support the prosperity gospel as preached. I do not. In fact I attend a church where one of the ministers that used to believe it is preaching a series called The Gospel of Greed. However we are living in the US where we have a constitution that is supposed to guide our conduct and the conduct of our government. Even as repugnant as their teachings are concerning finances, that is not enough for our government to go after them if they have been complying with the iRS rules.
I'm not a constitutional expert by any means. I just get concerned that people that disagree with the preachers not complying are judging them as lawbreakers. If they are breaking the law they should be punished. But don't go against to constitution to do it. That would set a dangerous precedent where they can come after us just because they do not like us. That is no different than a dictatorship.
John Piper wrote that we have "domesticated godliness into an inoffensive middle-class morality and law-keeping". The Gospel is not preached, so many have done away with the Cross and the Blood of Christ, without which we can have no relationship with God. We follow the Lamb of God, His Son, that we might learn to love as He loves, patiently forebearing the sufferings of life in the world without repining while trusting our Father in heaven. The worldly man cannot see Christ through the defended deception prevalent in the church in this nation. So many now follow dark worldly stars, false teachers who deceive others as well as they are deceived into practicing an empty religion based on man's faulty wisdom and fueled by materialism not devout love and reverance for Almighty God and a living relationship with the risen Lord Jesus Christ and a love for truth that knows no fear of man. The worldly man sees these deceived Christians longing for the same fame, fortune, and glory in this corrupt and fallen world that he himself seeks; thus he sees their religion as a grossly ignorant crutch for the unstable and superstitious. The believer must repent of worldly cares that lead to the selfish sins of despair, doubt, and despotism, and expose and turn away from all false teachers who deny the Truth and are greedy for material gain, and show forth the eternal worth and glory of Christ Jesus, for His life of sacrificial love is our Way.