I personally challenge all Evangelical Pastors to take a vow of Poverty when they become a Pastor, just like Catholic Priests do. If you want to follow me, carry your cross, sell all your things if you want to be perfect. The Apostles are the perfect model for anyone who wants to be a Pastor, so having a Pastor who makes a lot of money is unbiblical, unsound, immoral and of the devil. CAN I ...more

I personally challenge all Evangelical Pastors to take a vow of Poverty when they become a Pastor, just like Catholic Priests do.

If you want to follow me, carry your cross, sell all your things if you want to be perfect. The Apostles are the perfect model for anyone who wants to be a Pastor, so having a Pastor who makes a lot of money is unbiblical, unsound, immoral and of the devil.

CAN I GET AN AMEN!less

The catholic bible was written in the 4 century, the KJV was written in the 1600`s , so there is a big difference. Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_difference_between_the_Catholic_Bible_and_the_King_James_Version#ixzz1IDm8mphQ

A poll done early last year in 2010 by the USCCB, said that while there is a small support for gay unions among non-active or less participating Catholics. There is an overwhelming percentage of Catholics who are practicing who are against any form of civil union or gay marriage. The number they had released was 83% were against. So, for those Catholics and recent converts to Catholicism like m...more

A poll done early last year in 2010 by the USCCB, said that while there is a small support for gay unions among non-active or less participating Catholics. There is an overwhelming percentage of Catholics who are practicing who are against any form of civil union or gay marriage. The number they had released was 83% were against.

So, for those Catholics and recent converts to Catholicism like myself who came from the evangelical world. Catholics who practice their faith are strongly against gay marriage, and those who don't attend regularly are by a slim margin for it. Another study said those who are very devout in their faith vote Republican and those who are not practicing their faith vote Democrat.

So, the Holy Word of God brings some to truth and some to error is the point. The Bishops of our church and the Pope are 100% against Gay Marriage. In fact, the Catholic Church in California was attacked mercilessly by Homosexual activists because of our strong stance against gay marriage.

The nice thing about our church is that our church no matter what popular opinion is the CC will never change our view of Truth.less

Has anyone ever see him speak? He looks like an accountant trying to be cool. It doesn't work and it looks like he is trying to hard. Please Jesus give us a candidate who will help defeat the Evil Empire!

I was in Brazil for a two week conference. What a great trip. I can tell you that these numbers cannot be close to true. At a catholic charismatic church three out of every four people were former evangelicals who started out being Catholic and then returned. Why I asked? After a few years in these Prosperity churches, they realized that this is not the true Gospel. You don't see these Prosper...more

I was in Brazil for a two week conference. What a great trip. I can tell you that these numbers cannot be close to true.
At a catholic charismatic church three out of every four people were former evangelicals who started out being Catholic and then returned.

Why I asked? After a few years in these Prosperity churches, they realized that this is not the true Gospel. You don't see these Prosperity pastors in the poorest villages helping people, but you constantly see Catholic Priests and nuns in the worst areas serving the needs of the poor.

Many come back for the true Gospel of Grace, which means carrying your cross to follow him. Following Jesus is the hardest thing you'll ever do, but it will truly set you free.

Brazil's Catholic population is getting a wake up call, and this is good because the Bishops took for granted their sheep because their were no wolves. Now, there are wolves in sheeps clothing that serve a prosperity gospel and fake healings. These pastors are worth millions, and quite a few have committed fraud as evidenced by one of the most famous churches that the soccer star Kaka goes to. His pastors were both convicted of fraud and embezzlement.

As a third generation evangelical pastor who recently converted to Catholicism, I encourage you to seek the faith of the Apostles not the faith of some charismatic speaker.less

JesusComeQuick, You should read what you wrote. No works are needed, eh? Asking Jesus in to your heart is a work and confessing is a work. Faith is a gift, God gives it to you before you ask. Repenting from sins is a work, confessing is a work, living holy is a work, getting baptised is a work. Faith and works saves you, faith without these things is not faith at all. Don't misread what...more

JesusComeQuick,

You should read what you wrote. No works are needed, eh?
Asking Jesus in to your heart is a work and confessing is a work. Faith is a gift, God gives it to you before you ask.

Repenting from sins is a work, confessing is a work, living holy is a work, getting baptised is a work.

Faith and works saves you, faith without these things is not faith at all.
Don't misread what Paul wrote. The Works he speaks about is Works of the Mosaic Law, not the 10 commandments. Jesus commands us to keep his commandments, not the Mosaic law.less

The point is there are always innocent people killed when the Terrorists hide amongst the everyday people for cover. Cowards. So, Yes innocent people are killed but are they that innocent when they allow Terrorists to live amongst them? It is not the US intention to kill innocent people and we have invented technology like smart bombs and smart bullets at a very high cost because we don't want ...more

The point is there are always innocent people killed when the Terrorists hide amongst the everyday people for cover. Cowards. So, Yes innocent people are killed but are they that innocent when they allow Terrorists to live amongst them?

It is not the US intention to kill innocent people and we have invented technology like smart bombs and smart bullets at a very high cost because we don't want to kill any innocent people even by accident.

This stands in stark opposition to Muslims who mean to kil innocent men, women and children. They are all cowards as they do not attack our military, but unarmed men, women and children. They mean to kill innocent people and they are the target vs being a person who was killed by accident.

The heart of a Muslim terrrorists is pure evil.less

What's wrong with Pakistan? Easy..They are Muslim and serve a false prophet.

You should also know these sayings of Luther. Table Talk in De Wette, 5.188; De Wette was a protestant scholar who collected the most significant sayings of Luther in several volumes). Quote: “I look upon God no better than a scoundrel” (Weimar, Vol. 1, Pg. 487. Cf. Table Talk, No. 963) Quote: “I have greater confidence in my wife and my pupils than I have in Christ” (Ta...more

You should also know these sayings of Luther.

Table Talk in De Wette, 5.188; De Wette was a protestant scholar who collected the most significant sayings of Luther in several volumes).
Quote:
“I look upon God no better than a scoundrel”
(Weimar, Vol. 1, Pg. 487. Cf. Table Talk, No. 963)



Quote:
“I have greater confidence in my wife and my pupils than I have in Christ”
(Table Talk, 2397b)

Quote:
"Not for a thousand years has God bestowed such great gifts on any bishop as He has on me"
(Luther's Works, Erlangen ed., 61:422)

Quote:
“St. Augustine or St. Ambrosius cannot be compared with me.”
(Erlangen, Vol. 61, pg. 422.)

Quote:
"They are fools who attempt to overcome temptations [to lust] by fasting, prayer and chastisement. For such temptations and immoral attacks are easily overcome when there are plenty of maidens and women"
(Luther's Works, Jena ed., 1558, 2, 116; cited in P. F. O'Hare, "The Facts About Luther", Rockford, 1987, 311).

Quote:
"I confess that I cannot forbid a person to marry several wives, for it does not contradict the Scripture"
(De Wette, 2.459).

David Goldstein, the zealous Catholic convert from Judaism, rightly remarked:
Quote:
“The father of the first Protestant Church [Luther] changed the 28th verse of the 3rd chapter of St. Paul’s Epistle to the Romans to make it fit his doctrine that Christian faith minus Christian works is sufficient for salvation: ‘We hold that man is justified without works by the law of faith alone’. To one of his followers who complained that objection was being made to this perversion of the sacred text, Luther gave the cold comfort: ‘If any Papist annoys you with the word (alone) tell him straightway: Dr. Martin Luther will have it so: Papist and Anti-Christ are one and the same thing.’’ (Amic. Discussion, I, 127).

Goldstein goes on to explain the brutality of the Lutheran revolt: “The soldiers of the princes slaughtered the peasants, pillaged the churches and prevented Catholic worship in public. In this way Lutheranism was made the doctrine of the first Protestant Church — the State Church of Germany (1520).”

Your founder Martin Luther was an egomaniacle indidivdual who interpreted the scriptures based on his own ego and mental issues. He was a brilliant man in some areas and a fool in others. He had good reason to rail against the sale of indulgences, but he had no right to attack the Church Christ founded and divide it, which is against scripture. Paul talks vehemently against people who cause division.

Consider the fact the bible we love so much was given to us by God through his Holy instrument the Catholic Church. Consider your founder vs. the Christ and the Apostles who founded the Catholic Church. Seek Truth and you will become Catholic like I did.less

Hell is real, and not preaching about it is negligent. Cotton candy preaching is what's popular, but not helpful for your salvation.

Yes, the ELCA is apostate. I agree with you there. Remember what Luther said? "If it were not for the Papists we would not have the Holy Scriptures" or "Reason is the enemy of my faith" or " "If you are a preacher of grace, then preach a true and not a fictitious grace; if grace is true, you must bear a true and not a fictitious sin. God does not save people who are only fictitious sinners...more

Yes, the ELCA is apostate. I agree with you there.

Remember what Luther said?
"If it were not for the Papists we would not have the Holy Scriptures" or
"Reason is the enemy of my faith" or "
"If you are a preacher of grace, then preach a true and not a fictitious grace; if grace is true, you must bear a true and not a fictitious sin. God does not save people who are only fictitious sinners. Be a sinner and sin boldly, but believe and rejoice in Christ even more boldly . . . as long as we are here [in this world] we have to sin. . . . No sin will separate us from the Lamb, even though we commit fornication and murder a thousand times a day"
or
"I will not have Moses with his Law, for he is the enemy of the Lord Christ"
“Christ committed adultery first of all with the women at the well about whom St. John tell’s us. Was not everybody about Him saying: ‘Whatever has He been doing with her?’ Secondly, with Mary Magdalen, and thirdly with the women taken in adultery whom He dismissed so lightly. Thus even, Christ who was so righteous, must have been guilty of fornication before He died.”
or
“Christ committed adultery first of all with the women at the well about whom St. John tell’s us. Was not everybody about Him saying: ‘Whatever has He been doing with her?’ Secondly, with Mary Magdalen, and thirdly with the women taken in adultery whom He dismissed so lightly. Thus even, Christ who was so righteous, must have been guilty of fornication before He died.”

After reviewing the writings of Luther compared to the Scriptures, I found him to be basically a Nut Job, who had some valid points. But Luther threw the baby out with the bath water because of his ego when he left the Church.

I was a third generation evangelical pastor, who considered Lutheranism because I desperately didn't want to be Catholic. After testing the scriptures with the early church fathers and after reading Luther's writings, I ran to the Catholic Church.less

Celico is a brave woman who wants to spread the Gospel without any theological education. Amazing, but not surprising since her denomination was started by another women who had no theological background. http://www.rickross.com/reference/rebirth_in_christ/rebirth_in_christ6.html This Brazilian church is a cult based heavilly on the prosperity Gospel. It is extremely cultish and the founders...more

Celico is a brave woman who wants to spread the Gospel without any theological education. Amazing, but not surprising since her denomination was started by another women who had no theological background.

http://www.rickross.com/reference/rebirth_in_christ/rebirth_in_christ6.html

This Brazilian church is a cult based heavilly on the prosperity Gospel. It is extremely cultish and the founders of this church were found guilty of fraud, perjury and many other crimes.

I feel sorry for all the many people who followed them into this False Gospel.less

Why would anyone put 3 marks under disagree? You can go on the Saint Monica website and clearly see they are Catholic, not Episcopal. The article above made an error and Chris was only correcting it. Wow.

You are extremely naive, orthodox hope. If you think Evangelicals can even see a difference between Catholics and Orthodox you are sadly mistaken. I'm guessing you are pretty young too. Evangelicals try to convert every Christian who isn't of their own sect, even their own from one sect to another of evangelicalism. I also suggest you obey your Patriarch in all things, and see how the Orthodox...more

You are extremely naive, orthodox hope. If you think Evangelicals can even see a difference between Catholics and Orthodox you are sadly mistaken. I'm guessing you are pretty young too. Evangelicals try to convert every Christian who isn't of their own sect, even their own from one sect to another of evangelicalism.

I also suggest you obey your Patriarch in all things, and see how the Orthodox recent meeting in Ravenna Italy and in Greece, defined that the Bishop of Rome does have primacy in a unified church. Lastly,do some research on the topics you raised, because then you would know that today based on the recent Catholic-Orthodox dialogue that our view of purgatory and your view of judgement is almost identical sepparated by some misconceptions and cultural understandings from scripture. The Filioque is not an issue in substance or theology as recently stated by the Catholic-Orthodox Dialogue, but on the surface will need to be addressed. Careful with the Immaculate Conception since 9 of your auto-cephalous churches already accept it in its metaphysical and substantive nature. Again, language and culture divides but what we believe as Catholics and Orthodox is almost 90+% the same. Soon, hopefully to be 100% for full communion.

Try explaining your honoring of Mary and praying to the Saints to an Evangelical or confessing your sins to the Priest or the Eucharist being the true presence of Christ and a multitude more we both believe and an evangelical will say you and I are wrong.

There is only one church founded by Christ and in the first one thousand years we were one, now sepparated. Evangelicals are not even close to what we Catholics and Evangelicals believe because of their lack of Tradition, Apostolicity, Catholicity and Orthodoxy. Evangelicalism is not the fullness of Truth, while Catholic Orthdodoxy is.less

This is so sad. I will pray for their families and for the souls of those who were killed. "Eternal rest given to them oh Lord, and may your perpetual light shine upon them and I ask this in Jesus' name, Amen." God bless them for evangelizing in dangerous areas, may their crown in heaven be brilliant!

Yes, the church does clarify doctrines over time. Baptizing infants is not explicit in scripture, but it is implicitly supported where entire families were baptized. Children and infants were among those families one could assume. Acts 16:15, Acts 16:33, 1 Cor 1:16 "Whole households, All his family, All her household." This implies infants too. Baptism of infants was attacked in the 3rd ce...more

Yes, the church does clarify doctrines over time.

Baptizing infants is not explicit in scripture, but it is implicitly supported where entire families were baptized. Children and infants were among those families one could assume. Acts 16:15, Acts 16:33, 1 Cor 1:16 "Whole households, All his family, All her household." This implies infants too.

Baptism of infants was attacked in the 3rd century, so the church responded. So, for 200+ years no one attacked this belief and practice.

"Baptize firs the children; and if they can speak for themselves, let them do so. Otherwise, let their parents or other relatives speak for them." St. Hippolytus of Rome 215AD Apostolic Traditions 21

"the Church received from the Apostles th etradition of giving baptism also to infants." Origen 244ad, Commentary on Romans 5, 9.

In 252ad, the Council of Carthage condemned the opinion that infants must wait until the eighth day after birth to be baptized, as was the case with circumcision. St. Cyprian of Carthage, Letter 64
This letter was because of what Paul said how baptism replaced circumcision and the 8th day was when you were circumcized.

There is tons more, but this is just a taste.less

Cont'd on the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist St. Ignatius who was discipled by Peter and Paul wrote in 110 AD. He was the Bishop of Antioch who was sent to Rome to be martyred and eaten by Lions. "Heretics abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the Flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ.." Letter to Smyrnaens 6,2. St. Justin Marty...more

Cont'd on the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist

St. Ignatius who was discipled by Peter and Paul wrote in 110 AD. He was the Bishop of Antioch who was sent to Rome to be martyred and eaten by Lions.

"Heretics abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the Flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ.." Letter to Smyrnaens 6,2.

St. Justin Martyr wrote in 150 AD. " Not as common bread nor common drink do we receive these; but as we have been taught, the food which has been made into the Eucharist by the Eucharistic prayer set down by Him, and by the change of whih our blood and flesh are nourished, is both the Flesh and Blood of that incarnated Jesus." First apology 66, 20

I have many other references from Early church fathers who were personally discipled by the Apostles. This is what the Apostles taught and everyone believed it.less

Muggleborn, in terms of transsubstantiation I am not in a semantics game but a definition game. The word transsubstatiation was invented by the Catholic Church as was the word Trinity and Incarnation. It doesn't matter if these words are in the bible, only if you agree with what they mean. If you don't believe that a change occurs with the elements of bread and wine and Jesus is truly present i...more

Muggleborn, in terms of transsubstantiation I am not in a semantics game but a definition game. The word transsubstatiation was invented by the Catholic Church as was the word Trinity and Incarnation. It doesn't matter if these words are in the bible, only if you agree with what they mean.

If you don't believe that a change occurs with the elements of bread and wine and Jesus is truly present in the Eucharist while the bread and wine still appear to the senses as just that, then you have taken a position that is not supported by Scripture or Tradition. Scripture supports a literal understanding and history supports that position 100% without exception. The Early church wrote strongly about eating the flesh of our Lord and drinking his blood. While it still tastes like wine and bread, He is truly present in those elements.

All Christendom accepted this; Catholics, Orthodox and Oriental, Coptic and Armenian. These eldest daughter churches of Christ founded by Apostles all have the same understanding of the Eucharist. Anglicans have a similar understanding, then Lutherans to a lesser degree and then it continues to get watered down until it is only a symbol. You can't bring guilt on yourself from a symbol, but only the real thing. Paul in 1Cor 10:16 describe the Eucharist as being a participation in the body and blood of the Lord and 1Cor 11:23-29 describes being guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord by receiving it unworthilly.

Those are strong words, because Jesus is truly present in the Eucharist. Do we know how, no. Do we care how? No. We have simply have faith in what He said and we take Him at His Word.less

Muggleborn, I will pray for that individual who keeps setting dates of the end times. We should also pray for his mental state too. Scripture forbids us to set a date of Christ return. We do not have any differences I believe on the Divinity of Christ or his full humanity. The Catholic Church set this straight 1700 years ago and we've never changed our position. In terms of why you are supri...more

Muggleborn, I will pray for that individual who keeps setting dates of the end times. We should also pray for his mental state too. Scripture forbids us to set a date of Christ return.

We do not have any differences I believe on the Divinity of Christ or his full humanity. The Catholic Church set this straight 1700 years ago and we've never changed our position.

In terms of why you are suprised by my comment that only the Catholic Church has the right to interpret is because it is her book. I'm not sure why you are surprised by that. As an evangelical, I know we didn't write it or define how many books went into the NT. In fact, did you know the Epistles were originally called the Catholic Epistles in the 2nd and 3rd century? The Catholic Church defined her own inspired book. It is her's. I would think that you could logically see that if you wrote the scriptures and defined them then it is your book given by God. Was there any other church at the time???? Nope.

You have to take off your contemporary glasses because you are positing a modern perspective on the scriptures which doesn't work. Yes, the bible belongs to all of us because we are all God's children. At a gut level I get that and everyone should be able to read it so the Holy Spirit can work in our lives. Absolutely! But for everyone to have the right to interpret is only the gift given to the church at Pentecost, but that is not your church it is mine. Baptists and evangelicals didn't exist. It was only the one, holy, catholic and apostolic church that existed. The power to bind and loose(Mt 16:18, Mt 18:18) was only given to the Apostles and Apostles to Bishops. The power to forgive sins, expel demons, bind and loose and be lead into all Truth was passed down through the laying of hands. If the person who started your church didn't receive the laying of hands from someone who had apostolic authority, then they have no authority no matter how passionate they are about God.

If you believe context in scripture is important, then I would challenge you to find your church in the scriptures. Only the apostles, then the bishops had authority. No, church has Christ authority except Catholic and Orthodox. It doesn't mean you can't preach about the Lord, but it means you cannot teach or preach in an offical capacity unless you have authority to do so. So, if you and I lived back then we would have no authority or right to say the scriptures say anything as we have not been given the gift to be lead into all Truth, which was passed down through the laying of hands.less

Muggle born, Your first comment below about authority is quite interesting. In the beginng the Catholic Church did do exactly what you said and still does today. The Council of Jerusalem is perfect example of the Laity and those with authority challenging a doctrine that Gentiles had to be circumcised. The council deliberated, but in the end Peter spoke about his dream. He didn't refer to scriptu...more

Muggle born,
Your first comment below about authority is quite interesting. In the beginng the Catholic Church did do exactly what you said and still does today. The Council of Jerusalem is perfect example of the Laity and those with authority challenging a doctrine that Gentiles had to be circumcised. The council deliberated, but in the end Peter spoke about his dream. He didn't refer to scripture as his authority, but went against the Old Testament saying believers were no longer defined by Mosaic law and that circumcission was a shadow of what was to come which is baptism. As Paul states, Baptism has replaced circumcission.Col 2:11-12.

The problem with your idea is that Martin Luther did not handle his issues in a biblical manner. If he did, there would not be Protestants today. I'm not saying there were not signficant issues at the time, but the fact remains he had no authority to interpret, but could test the scriptures against belief and should have referred this complaint or issue to his bishop. The Bishop would have met with other Bishops and they would have decided it in his own diocese. The problem was his personality and ego would not allow him to do that, because he knew he would have to accept their decision whether he agreed or not. For Luther, he would rather break up the church's unity for the sake of having it his own way and not submitting to Apostolic authority.

Show me anywhere in scripture where a random person could start his own church or interpret on their own in an official manner. It didn't happen, so the Protestants of the 16th century were not biblical in their actions, since they did not follow the biblical record on how to settle debates and be guided into all Truth. Paul spoke vehemently against division and Christ called us to perfect unity of faith. We had it for most of 1600 years. Catholics and Orthodox share 98% of beliefs, while Protestants share about 80% and evangelicals and baptists share even less.less