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Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free. (JN 8:32)
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I challenge anyone who is in favour of this to support their reasoning with Scripture. Rather than appealing to the emotions please provide Biblical support for why this acceptable - oh and the Scripture has to be in context.
:)
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There is nothing wrong with a big church if there is a godly pastoral staff in place. Just as there is nothing wrong with a small church if it has a godly pastor serving faithfully.
My contention with these kinds of articles is the definition of growth.
You can claim to have several conversions but are we closely examining the Gospel that is preached. Joel Osteen has only one message recycled over and over again. It is feel good self help pop-psychology. His church is packed - he would claim people are getting saved.
1) Does the church preach repentance of sin - and faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour, because many say things like just trust Jesus. Jesus never said just trust Jesus, He specifically said repent for the kingdom of God is at hand.
2) Acts chapter 2 shows that faithful obedience is more important than programs or technique. People were being saved because the people studied the Word, and gave themselves to prayer. Is that part of the church? If a sermon is 35 minutes of fluff with one Scripture quoted out of context then it is irrelevant if more people are coming to your church.
3) My other question is how much is personality driven (ie the pastor is really cool) versus I come here to hear the Word of God?
This fastest growing - largest church stuff is silly imo, however if we desire the church to grow and be massive because we have a burden to see people saved from the Lake of Fire, and to bring glory to God, then let us pray that God will give the increase and our churches will be filled to overflowing not for our ego.
Obama - nation of desolation --> Maybe....
I'm sure it won't be long till someone writes another book using Christianity to make some $$$.
Never does God ask us to try to figure out who the Anti-Christ is in Scripture.
We are told to Love the Lord our God - Love our Neighbour - To walk humbly and love mercy - to be Holy because God is Holy - and even to be ready for the return of Christ.
Is Obama a prototype of the Anti-Christ - perhaps from the point of view that so many people follow him with blind loyalty and hopeful expectation.
What can we say more than that - the video attached to this article was simply embarassing for Christianity.
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This article has nothing to do with the OSAS debate
Salvation - Ephesians 2:8-9
Baptism - Matthew 28 - Baptism is a result of faith in obedience to an UNDERSTANDING of the Word - anything done without Jesus Christ as Saviour and without understanding is just getting wet
Anti Baptism is meaningless as pictured in the spirit of Hosea 7:14 - They do not cry out to me from their hearts but wail upon their beds.
The Hebrew word for cry is howl - like a dog - and the atheist is like an animal who gives themselves over to nature and instinct ignoring the plain evidence of God before them - Romans 1
And before you say I am too harsh - Atheism is the conscious rejection of God - I pray that they would be brought to repentance by faith in Jesus Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit's regeneration
And a shout out to my Calvinistic brothers and sister (absolutely unrelated to the post but shameless promotion none the less).
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The sad thing is this doesn't really alarm anyone anymore. I am pretty sure that the churches of North America are full of people who have accepted Jesus. This of course is not really what Scripture requires of us, we are not to accept Jesus, but rather Christ accepts us. If He accepts us, then we are to walk in the way that He requires (Be Holy for I am Holy). We do not preach repentance, eternal separation from God in the lake of fire, or that there is a cost to following Jesus. We just ask Him into our heart (whatever that means - can't find that phrase in Scripture). What Jesus said was repent, then to learn to observe all that He had commanded (progressive sanctification).
JC Ryle said that Christianity without the cross will never produce a Christian with a crown.
We want the benefits but we don't want to take it seriously that following Christ means forsaking our former sinful way of life.
The message is not complicated - Romans 10:9 confirms this to us, but the easy believism of today is a counterfeit gospel, that makes people comfortable enough to show up to church, but angry if you ask them to submit to the will of God.
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The guy took a stand in a public arena - You are the light of the world - a city on a hill cannot be hidden - Matthew 5:14
Good for him.
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While Christians in countries like India are being persecuted, we are deeply offended by some name calling.
Jesus promised that persecution would follow, but the persecution complex of the North American church is more akin to having someone's ego ruffled than truly counting the cost of taking up the cross.
The very fact that we can make a hollywood style top ten list about our so called "Christian bashing" moments, leaves me wondering what the purpose of this list is other than entertainment.
The mockers and skeptics will always be there, and they always have, complaining about them is hardly what Jesus said to do - Pray for those who persecute you.
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All that critics of each age have ever proven in their tired and weary statements about their own superior intellect and how they have removed the "religion" is that when they are gone from this life, the Word of God still stands.
This is not to sound self-righteous but if this man alarms you, be aware that he is not the first nor will he be the last
Bottom line, unless the Holy Spirit removes the blindness from his life he will continue to hate God, and none of us are better than him, because we all hate God until Christ reconciles us to God the Father through His blood
Pray for his salvation
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Stanj said - "Usually when someone is trying to scare someone or mis-lead them they point to Revelation. No other book in the Bible is filled with such symbolism as Revelation. We do know that our instructions as Christians can be found in the Gospels of our Lord and Savior Christ Jesus. The victory over the Devil belongs to Christ, it is not our battle, except for the battle to resist temptation."
The book of Revelation is scary because it is true - all those Christians who want to pretend that life is fine while they accumulate material wealth will indeed be suprised by the return of Christ.
Is God loving - YES! But He is also just and will judge the living and the dead. People ARE going to the lake of fire forever and if that doesn't upset us and make us desire to cast off the whole Jesus stereotype that He is some kind of gentle friend who pets sheep and walks in fields of buttercups barefuot - then we are not reading the Bible.
When He comes back he is the judge that will cast people into the lake of fire - He will make war and the blood will be to the bridle of the saddle.
Yet for the believer the book of Revelation is hope because we know that we who were once His enemies will reign forever with Him.
More Revelation preaching would be a good thing in my opinion. (And by the way telling people the danger of ignoring God's wrath is not scare tactics - that if anything is TRUE love)
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Willow Creek just discovered that teaching the Bible to people gives them spiritual depth - this is truly a shocking revelation - I am glad they did research and surveys to find this out.
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Smithdl you are welcome to your comments but they do not in any way address anything that was being discussed. Passionate yes, but they vacillate between personal conviction and factual statement while ignoring the fact that Rick Warren's primary method of communication is through pragmatic didactics.
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"At Saddleback, our staff is highly educated! Weve done more things that didnt work than did."
If God is in something can it be a failure? While the idea of doing what works is nothing new I would challenge us to make a paradigm shift and do "what is biblical"
When we do what is biblical people reject us - they get mad - they respond in opposition - is that failure because it didn't work? Or rather is that faithfulness that persists. Accolades from people is not our highest priority IMO, or even getting a thumbs up because they like what we are doing - doesn't the very nature of what we do offend, if we are a minister of the Gospel?
" Prosperity: God says in verse 8 Dont let the book of the law depart from your mouth. Meditate on it day and night. Be careful to obey everything written in it. Then youll be prosperous and successful. Prosperity is being everything God wants you to be, having Gods blessing your life, and using the talents he has given you. God guarantees that youll have more than you need if you trust in him."
Prosperity I would argue is humbling yourself before God, repenting of sin, and being obedient. The key to success is obedience according to Joshua 1:8. Prosperity is not a big church (though that is not sinful necessarily) prosperity is not even lots of people following after you. Jesus had eleven committed disciples and many fair weather friends.
"God wants you to have success in ministry." - Jeremiah never had a single convert
Just wondering and willing to hear some counter arguments I just personally see a thin veneer of biblical terminology painted over pragmatism
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MsnChris - 30 - 40 % are genuine believers - can I ask how you talked to God directly and He gave you the stats?
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Msnchris - I was a Calvinist and Baptist until I was converted - ???
I am assuming from your commentary that you were converted to Roman Catholicism - and if you believe that Roman Catholicism is unified in its theology then you my friend are gravely mistaken. There are many splinter groups within the Catholic faith and many have been disciplined out of the Roman Catholic church for their varying understanding of doctrine, but to simply paint a picture of unified theology in Roman Catholicism is disingenuous.
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Even better if you read Colossians 3:16 and 17 together
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It is easy to take shots at this kind of music but sadly this isn't the true issue because there are just as many Christian artists who play and sing the "acceptable" forms of music and live like the devil in divorce, adultery, smoking, and drinking.
I have seen this first hand - the problem is not a style problem - if people want to condemn young people maybe they should ask them why this is happening - if you want young people to be biblically discerning then maybe we should have taught them well from the start in our churches.
Maybe as parents we should have taught them well in our homes, but we haven't (and I am generalizing because there are those who have)
Throwing one verse out of context like a molotov cocktail does not teach the Word of God it makes the Bible a weapon used to promote our own agendas
Intergenerational worship of God should be our goal - but that comes with a price - it means not being selfish and getting my way and my experience out of church - it means loving those around you - and casting aside the so called niches of music that plague the Christian church
And for anyone who is militantly hymn only - Read Colossians 3:16 - are hymns the only required form of music by God? In fact we would be sinning if we did only use hymns.
And this is not a leave the kids alone argument either - because everything is not well with our disaffected youth
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If you have nothing to hide - why do you feel threatened - Accountability is a hallmark of Christian character. The Lord calls us to be transparent and accountable before HIm. If we are to shine as stars in a crooked and perverse nation - then we need to be righteous.
BE SURE YOUR SIN WILL FIND YOU OUT!
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Elbeau- the reason for clarification of language is because evangelicals use terms such as born again and it does not mean the same thing to everyone
The same is true of Jesus Christ - who evangelicals say He is and who LDS say He is - are actually different - that is why we must make our stand clear and that applies to any faith not just evangelical Christians - I think we just need to be honest in saying that we don't believe the same thing - there is no shame in that - I just think it is silly to try to put it all in one melting pot
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Elbeau- the reason for clarification of language is because evangelicals use terms such as born again and it does not mean the same thing to everyone
The same is true of Jesus Christ - who evangelicals say He is and who LDS say He is - are actually different - that is why we must make our stand clear and that applies to any faith not just evangelical Christians - I think we just need to be honest in saying that we don't believe the same thing - there is no shame in that - I just think it is silly to try to put it all in one melting pot
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Elbeau - thank you for being straight forward - most people don't understand LDS doctrine so when you speak clearly in non- LDS language for us non-LDS it helps - so thank you
But I am alarmed that you confirmed what I said - that you definitely believe we become a god of our own planet
As far as an evangelical politcal government goes - I am not an american and do not have the evangelical culture of america which is very different from other parts of the world
We know that unless God is in the heart of the ruler they do wicked (look at the book of Kings and Chronicles) and that according to Daniel God appoints the rulers so for me the issue is to support our leaders through prayer and petition the Lord to remove the wicked ones
I don't believe in forced conversion
I honestly think Christians who seek God would make great leaders but the real issue is that when people turn away from the Word of God they practice idolatry
On our own we are little more than bits of stone and glass. Together we are the Body of Christ. Holy Bible: Mosaic is an invitation to experience Christ in His Word and in the responses of his people. Each week, as you reflect on guided Scripture readings aligned with the church seasons, you will receive a wealth of insight from historical and contemporary writings.