Kid Preachers Pulpit-Bound by Divine Inspiration, They Say

finny »

Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:13 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

Did I really say "ordinate"? I meant "ordain." My math background came up and bit me, I guess.

Kid Preachers Pulpit-Bound by Divine Inspiration, They Say

finny »

Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:04 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

Servent,

I think you hit the nail on the head. Many denominations, especially Pentecostal, which is what this church appears to be, ordinate both pastors and evangelists. The latter are responsible for going from place to place directing peoples' hearts back to God. They are often featured at revival meetings. This makes sense in this boys case if this is what his church practices. And this would certainly explain the disconnect in our debate. If this kid were ordained as a full-fledge pastor, then yes, that would indicate a problem. My apologies for not catching this ecclesiological nuance sooner. Thanks servent.

Kid Preachers Pulpit-Bound by Divine Inspiration, They Say

finny »

Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:23 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

zenodaddy,

I think Scripture disagrees with you. Here is Matthew 3:1-2.

1In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,
2And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

As you can see, Matthew does call shouting a few words, as you say, preaching. If you look up in your Strong's Concordance, Greek #2784, which the word used here for "preaching", it means: to "herald", espec. divine truth (the gospel).

So this boy is, in fact, preaching by the Biblical definition.

I don't think anyone is asking this child to exegete the Greek text, know about text recentions, or the like. That'd be for the role of a teacher. I don't think he'd get involved in marriage counseling either. I do suspect that he'll get better as he gets older. And I also hope he'll pursue formal theological education when of an appropriate age and opportunity arises. But in the meantime, maybe we can encourage the boy to continue to grow in the Lord. If you don't like what the boy says, you don't have to go to his church. True?

Kid Preachers Pulpit-Bound by Divine Inspiration, They Say

finny »

Thu Oct 25, 2007 2:22 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

zenodaddy

“…I find the situation disturbing. If the Holy Spirit was talking through this boy, then he would have more to say then 'Repent and be saved'.”

So if “Repent and be saved” doesn’t constitute preaching, what do you say about John the Baptist? He, we know, had the Holy Spirit. Would you say he wasn’t preaching either?

“‘Now, if the Holy Spirit was speaking through him, then he would also know that Jesus did not begin at the age of 12 and would not need 'people' to tell him otherwise.’”

What do you think Jesus was doing in the Temple when He was 12? Were the old men dazzled by His silence? It seems clear to me that He was teaching them about the oracles of God; In other words, He was preaching!

“‘I see this more of an out for the dad to live through his son.’”

This may or may not be true. If it is true, do you have more that your suspicion to present? If it’s not true, then aren’t you defaming one of God’s children?

“‘This boy is far too young and theologically, and doctrinally ignorant to be preaching.’”

Isn’t this what the Jewish leaders said about the apostles? I don’t think omniscience is a prerequisite for preaching. One ought to preach what one knows for sure, and grow in respect to knowledge as the years pass.

“'began preaching after being saved by Jesus when he was only three years old.'
Now, I know of no three year olds that are mature enough to understand why they would need salvation. ‘”

You know of this boy, but you are rejecting his testimony. He seems to know that you can’t live a sinner’s life and be saved.

“If you notice from the article, the people who 'ordain' these kids are usually their relatives or parents. Why is that? “

It could simply be, as I mentioned in a previous response, that he was ordained simply to get preaching engagements. Many denominations and independent require ordination to be in the pulpit. We don’t know for sure. But I do acknowledge the trend, but it’s no sin.

“If the children are 'divinely' inspired, wouldn't a minister or seminary ordain these kids?”

According to the article, His grandmother is a pastor and she ordained him.

Kid Preachers Pulpit-Bound by Divine Inspiration, They Say

finny »

Thu Oct 25, 2007 1:43 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

PDF,

"Ordination" is a convoluted term nowadays. What is he ordained to do? Simply to preach? Or is it something more? And who ordained him, God or man? If man, for what reason? It could simply be, as is normative nowadays, to get preaching engagements. Sometimes they pass it out like candy just to get an audience. I don’t necessarily agree with it, but it happens.

Aside from that, I have listened to many "ordained" preachers that aren't worth their salt. And I've listened to many non-ordained Christians who have given some incredible insight into Scripture.

So I'd go back to where I started and rely on what the boy says, ordination or no ordination.

Kid Preachers Pulpit-Bound by Divine Inspiration, They Say

finny »

Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:50 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

jicarpenter,

We're not talking about elders, deacons and pastors. We're talking about "preaching." They are very different issues. Elders and deacons DO have a age requirement, which is the context you are citing, and that has more to do with maturity than age. If you mix these two issues then it makes Scripture really confusing. It sounds to me like you can't tell anybody about Jesus unless your 30? Now that doesn't make sense.

Kid Preachers Pulpit-Bound by Divine Inspiration, They Say

finny »

Thu Oct 25, 2007 8:40 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

My apologies, servant, for including you. You weren't the author of the entry I was referencing. It was late; my eyes must have been crossed. :( Sorry.

I do agree with you, however, that many televangelists and self-proclaimed "prophets" have disgraced the name of the Lord by both their teachings and actions. As you say, we as Christians must do due diligence in discerning any given preacher's words. Age or lack thereof, however, is not a litmus test for whether one can or cannot preach God's word. Age may be a consideration, but not a determinant.

One last point as I'm thinking about it. As far as Jesus ministry, I agree that it did "officially" begin when he was about 30, but He was, in fact, teaching those old men in the Temple at the age of 12. I don't think anyone would say that whatever Jesus said in the Temple that day was invalid because he was underage. He didn’t “suddenly” have something to say at age 30. Just a thought.

And thanks for the tip about the movie. If I get some time, I’ll have to look it up.

In God’s peace,
Finny

Kid Preachers Pulpit-Bound by Divine Inspiration, They Say

finny »

Wed Oct 24, 2007 9:49 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

zenodaddy, servant, and pdf

When Jesus' disciples tried to stop others from using Jesus' name, Jesus said not to stop them, for they wouldn't ever speak ill of Jesus. (Mark 9:39) This boy you are criticizing is giving glory to God and Jesus. Do you wish to stop him?

Furthermore, when Jesus was making His triumphant entry into Jerusalem and the people were shouting praises to God, the Pharisees told Jesus to shut them up. But Jesus stated that if they became silent, the stones would cry out. (Luke 19:37-40) What will you accomplish by shutting the mouth of this young boy?

At Pentecost (Acts 2:16-21) Peter cites Joel which states that there is no age, gender, social or racial boundaries when it comes to whom God will pour out His Spirit. If God does not disqualify this boy, then why do you not hesitate to do so?

And are you so certain that the Holy Spirit is incapable of speaking through a child? Listen to what he is saying: "Repent and be saved." That is basically the message of Jesus, is it not? So does the boy's age invalidate Jesus' words?

Lastly, you are apparently indicting this young boy for the same fraud that Marjoe is guilty of? Do you have any evidence of this? In Matthew 7, Jesus says not to condemn another, lest you be condemned. Perhaps this little boy has a message for you.