Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:38 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

Yeah, it looks like most of them were myself and KevinT. Oh, well. I tried to help. Have a good day, all!

Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Sat Dec 01, 2007 8:01 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

That's a pretty cool quote, jc4me, but I'm not too sure if it's a response to me or a random posting or what your purpose is with it. I have an idea, but I'd like to hear from you.

ifeelfine: Thanks for the concern. I appreciate it. I see what you see here, but I still wanted to try. Truth above all and all that jazz.

Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Sat Dec 01, 2007 10:31 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

jc4me: If you don't mind me having a heated moment here, NAMBLA is gross. I can't believe that that organization exists. I am NOT a pedophile, and yet, because of this organization, people assume I am. Pedophilia, rape, and bestiality, all of which have been attributed to aspects of the GTBT community, are completely separate aspects of a person than homosexuality. Two men or two women consenting to love each other is very different in a nonconsentual situation such as rape or taking advantage of a child or animal.

And for you and the others on here who say that the bible can be rewritten to "be sensitive to the murderer, the fornicator, the wife beater, the serial killer and the adulterer as well," I challenge you to do so. Show that there are passages in the bible, based on the original text and that context of that text, that promotes those things as being okay. I've heard each of those groups justifying themselves with the Bible, but so far I haven't seen a study or report yet that says that the original text does not implicate those groups. Until you can bring forth the same points I'm trying to bring up, about misinterpretation in today's doctrine, how can you lump homosexuality with those sins?

Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Sat Dec 01, 2007 5:46 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 3

We're not "twisting the Bible to justify our sin", we're showing that there is truth in the Word that current doctrine fails to acknowledge. I've seen several people here, both pro-gay and anti-gay. who have provided different translations of the same passage. Anybody here should know that literally reading the Bible without any thought at all to the context of the passage results in statements that don't fit. If we read the Bible word-for-word and took the literal words as their own context (that is, once we decided which of the several current translations of the Bible to read from), then we would interpret that it took God six 24-hour periods to create everything (which would assume He obeyed a time system invented in the Roman age), and it would be impossible for a rich person to enter Heaven (good luck fitting that camel through a needle eye, right?). However, the magic of the Word lies in its context, in knowing more about the story thanks to further research, or understanding of the metaphor. What I see here among the dissenters is a failure to go beyond quoting from whatever translation they have available and prove their statements with context. The original scrolls that made up the first Bible were not written in English, and we assume that King James and his people translated everything in the context of what God wants. If I recall correctly, these are the same people who said you could buy your way into Heaven.

When you blindly follow the heard and don't research what you believe in yourself, I feel that is where evil can grab you and make you feel holy while you are actually doing wrong.

Also:

"One said I am disturbed. Another said the concept of homosexuality did not exist in biblical times. I appreciate the good laugh. You champions of perversion and immorality ought to go into the comedy business."

This statement is way more sarcastic than I'd expect from someone who claims to understand the true intentions of God. My understanding is that we should work toward humility, instead of making prideful statements. I apologize if I am misinterpreting you, but it feels to me that I am not.

Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Thu Nov 29, 2007 5:09 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 4

Which brings the story from another angle. As you can see, there are SO many diferent ways to interpret the words left us from the times written about in the Bible. I mean, just look at all the denominations we have in our faith. If there was one true way of thinking, if the Bible was as forward and clear-cut as some of you are saying/implying it is, then there wouldn't be so much disagreement within our own religion! What I'm trying to say here is that the Word is a LIVING document, not static, and there is more than one way to look at every passage, and that seems to be the prevelant reason why we cannot agree: you believe your interpretation is better or more accurate than mine.

My intention in looking further into the Bible isn't to "justify my sin" but rather to justify my existance. I know how I've felt over the pest couple decades and I've been trying to understand just why God would let me feel this way if the Bible says I should be killed on the spot for it. And when I put my faith in Jesus and ask for guidance, this is where He always seems to lead me: toward the idea that I'm okay, and that I need to try and search for the truth. I need to question everything and make sure that I'm on the right path.

And one question that I found out doesn't seem to have an answer yet: hemaphrodites. If gender roles were meant to be so static and rigid, why did He create people who have no discernable gender, or both genders? Are they technically homosexual (or even heterosexual or bisexual) if they are biologically both genders, or no real gender at all?

And for Jester: could you please point out to me a support group for recovering impotent people, people who were born with the sin of impotence but were healed through faith and prayer? Honestly, I want to know if it exists. By your logic, it should.

Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Thu Nov 29, 2007 5:08 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 3

This is kind along, so please bear with me:

"Leviticus 18:22
22 " 'Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.

The leviticus passage really leaves no room for interpretation does it?"

Actually, it does. I've seen it interpreted different ways, including the version you just quoted and "Man shouldn't have sex with another man in a woman's bed, because the bed is unclean." I've also seen the word "detestible" be published as "abomination", and if I recall correctly, the original word actually refers to ritual uncleanliness as opposed to grevious sin.


As as for the word "sodomy", the sin of Sodom was inhospitality, not homosexuality. That place was already slated for destruction due to all sorts of bad behavior, and an example chosen to be recorded in the writings that we now call The Bible was one of deep inhospitality. Men were greater than women at the time; women were pretty much just property. Thus, the worst way to treat someone was to treat him as a woman, i.e. rape him. And to do it to somone's guest...well, that was just downright evil. It was at this point that the angels saw that there was no redeeming the city, and sent Lot and his family on its way. I'm not sure why chrches don't testify this facy, because even Jesus references the story of Sodom as a warning against inhospitality.

And even what I've researched on the subject so far may be inaccurate. I recently saw this passage on a forum:

"With all that in mind, a far more consistent theory has been developed by Bible scholars. Since yadha' commonly means "to get acquainted with," the demand to "know" the visitors may well have implied some serious breach of the rules of hospitality. Several considerations provide support for this view.

In the first place, Lot was not a native of Sodom, but had the status of a resident alien, or stranger. As such, he may not have had the right to admit unidentified foreigners to the city. City gates were closed at night expressly to prevent lawless or subversive aliens from entering on unknown errands, and travelers carried credentials because they might at any time be asked to prove that they were abroad on legitimate business. Thus we might translate "Bring them out to us, that we may know them" as "We wish to know whom you are bringing as guests into our city." Lot's refusal to turn his visitors over to this horde of vigilantes is totally in keeping with the contemporary laws of etiquette, because in those days no civic police force protected strangers in a city. Any kind of robbery or physical abuse could have been meted out to the two angels if he had agreed to surrender them, but in his home they were safe. He was obliged to protect them as honored guests. It is certain that the Sodomites were demanding he violate the code of hospitality, but not at all clear from the text that they were inclined to indulge in homosexual acts."

Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:17 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

Also, this struck a chord:

"
Anyway, like I said before... stick 1000 gay people on an island, and they would go extinct... not exactly natural."

Stick 1000 people of the same gender on an island and of course you won't have reproduction. Stick 500 impotent men and 500 barren women on that same island, and you'll get the same result. Are you saying it's against nature to be born impotent, or to become impotent?

Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:14 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

Prophet:

"So you're saying it's okay to change what the Bible says to adapt to a person's will?"

What exactly does that mean, and what did I say that makes you think I said that?

Also, the passage you chose from Romans seems to say that people are gay because they are evil, because they committed some heinous sin and turned away from God, so lusting after the same sex is their punishment. If that's true, I'd honestly like to know what I did that was so wicked and wrong before I hit the age of 10, because I was definitely aware of my feelings then, and for a couple years beforehand.

Christian Bookstores Refuse to Sell Gay Study Bible

kybarsfang »

Wed Nov 28, 2007 4:01 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 3

Whenever I see stuff like this, I always feel a need to bring up life in the 1950's. I can just imagine an article appearing in the local paper: "Black Study Bible stocked next to Christian Bible" or some sort. Outrage ensues. The bookstore that dares mix colored bibles with white folks' bibles is protested, maybe even attacked. And this behavior is acceptable. It's Christian. It's approved by God. Plain as day, anyone can see it if they just read the Bible.

Or let's go back even further, and out comes a Christian book that empowers women, treating them as equal as men. "Why do women need their own special Bible?" the men say. "They should be spending their time cookin' and cleanin', not readin'! David has many wives! Ruth didn't have many husbands!" or whatever was spouted out back then.

The point is, history repeats itself, and if you believe this instance with the dang queers is "different" and your hatred is justified because the Bible says so, you may want to look at what else the Bible supposedly justifies, and decide for yourself if you'll just take everything at face value, or if you love God enough and crave His Truth enough to do some research and ask Him to guide you toward the many possibilities that the Living Word has in store. Because of Him, you no longer have to kill your children for backtalking you. Because of Him, you can be a vegetarian without feeling guilty. Because og HIm, you can embrace the fact that you were born left-handed as a gift, and not a hell-given curse to overcome.

The Pharisees thought they knew the word of God, but Jesus showed them that it had been twisted by their own selfishness and arrogance. Whenever you decide to condemn someone based on what you think the Bible says, you may want to take a step back and see if you're approaching the situation with hate and arrogance, or if you can truly show humility and learn that there is more than one way to walk beside the Lord.