Philippines Catholic Church Mandates Prayer as 18th Typhoon Nears

philo777 »

Thu Oct 22, 2009 11:53 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

"Amazing the asanine comments from people who just can't get it throught their head that people believe differently then they do. What other childish rants are you going to throw out..."

How about this: Intercessory prayer has been shown in scientific double-blind studies to offer no better results then chance alone. It does not work! It has never been shown to work. Do you honestly think that babbling to the universe is going to cause a suspension of natural laws? Really?

You can believe whatever you want, but expect to get called on irrational behavior, because that's exactly what it is. We live on a geologically active planet whose atmosphere is currently undergoing a great deal of trauma due to man made global warming. Disasters like this one are going to continue, and get much, much worse. Praying over them is not going to help a bit.

What's needed is serious reduction in C02 emissions, much more stringent then called for in the current agreements. Time is running out. If you wish to pray for something, pray that the world leaders going to Copenhagen adapt a stringent reduction in fossil fuel use, or, frankly, our grandchildren will come of age in a totally different world.

In case anyone is interested, here is a link to a new report by a leading German climate scientist prepared for the Copenhagen meeting. http://www.wbgu.de/wbgu_sn2009_en.pdf

Philippines Catholic Church Mandates Prayer as 18th Typhoon Nears

philo777 »

Thu Oct 22, 2009 1:40 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 3

Welcome to the 21st century! We are still appeasing the volcano gods. Why not sacrifice a virgin, perhaps that might sooth him.

New Survey Reveals Huckabee as GOP's Leading Contender for 2012

philo777 »

Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:58 pm Agree: 10   Disagree: 2

Flagged as inappropriate. show I don't think many of you fully appreciate from whence cometh our strong religious heritage, and how fragile our religious freedoms really are. A reconstructionist like Huck who wants to "rewrite the Constitution to more closely reflect the word of god" could bring the whole thing crashing down around our ears. Read Madison's "Memorial and Remonstrance" if you want to see some good arguments against the Huckster. Yes, he is a "nice guy," but so what? He is, by far, the single most dangerous politician in America mostly because of his demeanor. Oh, heck, he's un-electable anyway, so what's the sense of stories like this? Isn't it more fun for you folks to fantasize about Palin anyway? hide

Atheists Promote 'Good Without God' Message in Big Apple

philo777 »

Tue Oct 20, 2009 2:53 pm Agree: 11   Disagree: 0

In a year or so there will be so many of these up all over the country that they won't even be news anymore.

New Survey Reveals Huckabee as GOP's Leading Contender for 2012

philo777 »

Tue Oct 20, 2009 2:48 pm Agree: 8   Disagree: 3

I think this is wonderful news - for the Democrats! The un-electable, reconstructionist has no chance of winning a national election, and therefore the Dems would welcome his nomination. The only worse candidate for the Republicans would be Palin, who would absolutely cement the demise of the Republican party.

Is it not clear to even the dimmest bulbs on the right that with only 20% of the electorate self-identifying as Republican that you MUST move to the left to have even a chance of winning a national election?

Christian Legal Group Hits $100 Million Mark in Pro Bono Work

philo777 »

Sun Oct 18, 2009 1:42 pm Agree: 4   Disagree: 1

Flagged as inappropriate. show While engaged in getting Thomas Jefferson's "Bill For Religious Freedom in Virginia" passed by the Virginia legislature, James Madison authored his famous "Memorial and Remonstrance." Signed by over two thousand Virginians, Madison said in part: "Who does not see that the same authority which can establish Christianity, in exclusion of all other religions, may establish with the same ease any particular sect of Christians, in exclusion of all other sects?" The "Memorial" was responsible for rallying all of the minority Christian sects to the passage of Jefferson's bill, as they were terrified of the possible re-establishment of the Church of England in Virginia. Christians, be careful what you wish for when you tamper with the first amendment. You could easily find your particular sect on the outside looking in. These safeguards were put in place for a reason. Madison et al knew exactly what they were doing, and don't forget that there are currently (according to the Christian Encyclopedia) 38,000 different sects and denominations of Christianity. hide

Massive Muslim Prayer in D.C. Incites Christian Prayers

philo777 »

Fri Sep 25, 2009 9:03 pm Agree: 7   Disagree: 15

Interesting that there will be about the same number of Muslims at this prayer rally as there were Glenbeckians in DC a couple of weekends ago. It's amusing that the more militant Christians feel threatened by this to the point that they are planning counter-prayers. Is this a "my god is more powerful then your god" thing?

Of much more concern to secular folks is the "Take back America" foolishness going on this weekend. There lies the real danger to our Constitutional government, the Christian Nationalists who want to institute their own flavor of Sharia law.

And you wonder why atheism is growing by leaps and bounds? You religious are bringing it on yourselves.

Pro-Life Leaders: Obama Still Misleading Americans on Abortion Funding

philo777 »

Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:40 am Agree: 7   Disagree: 8

Oh my goodness! Where are your stalwarts on the Republican side? Why are they not taking care of this? Oh, that's right, they're stonewalling the whole thing and refusing to negotiate.

Instead of being practical and pragmatic by realizing we had an election, which they lost resoundingly, and becoming a partner in framing health care reform, they would rather play for short-term political gain and remain outside the fray. And in taking this course, they are drawing even closer to their own fringe element, who is influencing them even more then their old partners, the religious right.

As a result, you who have supported the Republicans for years have no clout whatsoever, except whatever the Democrats choose to give you.

Don't blame the Democrats for what the Republicans can no longer give you. It's not primarily YOUR government any more as it was, to some extent under Bush. You sound like petulant children whose every whim is no longer being addressed.

Obama: Now is Time to Deliver on Health Care

philo777 »

Thu Sep 10, 2009 1:58 pm Agree: 6   Disagree: 3

Flagged as inappropriate. show Once again, Rollin, I didn't "blow off" anything! If you go to FOX, you will see a large picture with a headline "Pinping..." Below is a headline "11 ACORN workers arrested." Now tell me that the intent isn't to connect the arrests with the alleged investigation of pimping. The ACORN workers who were arrested are accused of stealing FROM ACORN! Furthermore, they were reported by ACORN. How does that translate into a "scandal" It doesn't! As the right continues the slide into total irrelevancy, you will get a lot more frustrated, but it is by your own choice. Look who you are having to associate with as Republicans now. I was a Republican most of my life, right up until they gave up the soul of conservatism in exchange for the support of the fanatical Christian right. They will either come back to their senses and stop pandering to you, or they will never be more then a regional party of rednecks, bigots, homophobes and fools. America needs two strong political parties, and right now there is only one. We have no choice but to do what is right for the country, leaving the rest of you behind. Keep taking cheap shots at Obama, he doesn't much care what you think, nor do the rest of us. hide

Obama: Now is Time to Deliver on Health Care

philo777 »

Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:41 am Agree: 4   Disagree: 2

Rollin, I think the "neglect" you speak of is not an indication of the media being in the tank, as Rush says, but simply means that most of us are completely fed up with FOX's lies and tactics.

In this instance, if you go to the fox web site, you will see a highly provocative picture with a headline indicating that lots of Acorn workers have been arrested, and you are led to believe that the arrests and investigations are having to do with the headline.

When you click through to the article, you find it's about something else altogether. The arrests and investigations have to do with voter registration fraud. In this case, as in ALL others, the Acorn workers were defrauding and stealing from Acorn!

"While they were attempting to steal from ACORN, they were stealing from our electoral process and we just will not tolerate that," she said."

Above is a quote from the article. Acorn, in fact, reported the fraud!

Just another example of FOX "reporting," and a great reason why the rest of the world ignores them. Unfortunately, there are those of you who think Glen Beck & company have the ONLY truth. Too bad for you!

As the president said last night, the rest of us have no time for fools and lairs!

1.2 Million Sign Anti-Health Care Bill Petition to Congress

philo777 »

Wed Sep 09, 2009 3:58 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 3

Keep it up and soon the only "health care" you will have access to is prayer. Would you be happy then? I don't think you understand that this is perhaps the last chance we will EVER have to get out from under the thumb of the insurance companies. If the Supreme Court rules on the "Hillary movie" thing the way it looks they might, we will all be nothing but serfs.

But then, I think that's what most of you want anyway. Christianity always has done better among the poor and downtrodden.

How long do you think it will be before the insurance companies treat ALL potential infant diseases (Downs syndrome for instance) as preexisting conditions and forces people to either abort or face financial ruin. I can hear the screams of the "righteous" now.

Heck, it's the logical next step! Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it!

Bishop: Pray for Those Without Work This Labor Day

philo777 »

Fri Sep 04, 2009 10:16 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

If prayer worked at all, we wouldn't NEED health insurance.

Survey Profiles Nonreligious Americans

philo777 »

Sat Aug 15, 2009 12:06 pm Agree: 5   Disagree: 1

" Lee Storbel is an excellent example and I would encourage you if you have not already to check out His "Case For Christ" book or video as well as many of Josn McDowell's books."

There you go again with the arrogance! Of course I've read Stroble, my eight-year-old grandson could debunk his foolishness. You really shouldn't quote him, he's a laughing stock in most circles. His "proofs" all come back to the same thing: "The bible is the word of god 'cause it says it is." Nothing else.

There are some really fine writings among the apologists, Christianity has produced some really fine minds, but I'm afraid that Lee isn't among them. In fact, none of the current crop of apologists have produced a darn thing that has advanced the debate.

I spend one of my high school years in a Jesuit school, Notre Dame of West Haven, CT. I met some fine men there, in fact that's where I learned to think critically. I didn't agree with them, most of the time, but there was mutual respect of a kind I don't discern in the current debate. I freely admit my occasional culpability, by the way, it's born mainly of frustration.

Anyhow, the brothers were not that interested in converting anyone, they were interested in making them thinkers, in the hope they would someday reason their way to god, or something. They also looked upon the natural world in almost a secular manner, and taught science - better science then the public schools were teaching at the time.

I kept in touch with one of the brothers right up 'till his death a few years ago. He was a good friend, and I miss him every day. We learned much from each other.

I'm done with this thread, it's too darn long.

Survey Profiles Nonreligious Americans

philo777 »

Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:45 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

"My personal view is that many non-believers are just that because many Christians by their lifestyle have not given them something or better said Someone to believe in."

As I said before, I know you are well-intentioned, but you just don't get it. Most Christians I know are fine people, just folks like I am, doing the best they can for themselves and their fellow men. I already have what you have, I just don't need what you THINK you need to achieve it.

I was brought up in a religious home, did the Sunday school and youth group bit, went to church camps every year & had a ball. Problem is, I just never bought it. There was no evidence behind what I was hearing. I don't need to go point-by-point here, it doesn't matter, for the purpose of this discussion.

There are many reasons I am a non-believer, some unique to Christianity, that's true, but most would apply to any theistic religion (There are lots of non-theistic religions, and they have their own problems).

Bottom line, I'm not an atheist 'cause no Christian has been a good witness, or because I don't know enough about "real Christianity," (In fact I probably know too much),because I "want to do whatever I want without any worries and, the one that really get my goat, because I'm "mad at God."

My goodness, every time I hear that last one.... What an absolutely stupid thing to say. Why in the world would I be mad at a being I don't believe in. Kind of like getting mad at Santa 'cause I didn't get a new sled. But you would be surprised that about half the time, that's the first thing I hear from theists.

I will say this, of all the religions on the planet, Christianity is the only one I know of whose adherents are arrogant enough to believe that the only reason others don't believe is that they don't know enough about it.

Survey Profiles Nonreligious Americans

philo777 »

Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:21 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

"perhaps some of you may have missed that non-religious people are less trusting. That's an important insight in ministering to the unbelieving world."

Sorry, Pastor, but that "insight" won't help you a bit. You might want to read the full article that I linked in an earlier post. "Less trusting," in this context indicates a reluctance to accept authority rather then evidence to prove points.

I trust most people until they prove to me that they are not trustworthy. That does not mean that I accept every thing they tell me as the absolute truth. You might be an auto mechanic, and if I trust you I would believe you when you told me my car needed an expensive part to fix a problem. That does not mean that I would believe your conversion story. Oh, I would accept that YOU believed in the existence of a supernatural being, but I would not accept that as a truth statement.

Do you get the difference? Let me ask you a question. You talk as though you think religion is some big con, and to fleece the suckers you first have to gain their confidence. Is that what you think? Atheists are suckers waiting to be conned?

If you want to convert atheists, start gathering evidence for the existence of God. Oh, by the way, it has to be original, OK, 'cause we've seen everything you have so far.

Good luck with that!

Survey Profiles Nonreligious Americans

philo777 »

Fri Aug 14, 2009 9:08 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 2

"Most atheists cannot defend with they believe with any depth at all"

???? Belief? What are you talking about? I have no belief whatsoever in the supernatural, how is that a position that needs defending? I make no claims, I do not try and prove a negative, atheism is simply a lack of belief.

I also strongly disagree with your assumption that atheism is based upon the rejection of incorrect assumptions. I know you would like to "believe" that because it might be uncomfortable for you to realize that 45 million of your fellow Americans (perhaps more by now) can look at the same information you do and come to a different conclusion.

Atheists don't tend to even use the word "belief" very often as it has a distinctly negative connotation to most of us. "Belief" is something one does when one has no evidence with which to justify a position. Belief also indicates (usually) a certitude that is not as a rule expressed by non believers.

If I was to ask most of the people on this board what evidence could convince them of the non-existance of God, most if not all would say "nothing, nothing at all would convince me that God didn't exist." No Atheist would make a statement like that. If evidence was presented to me that I considered compelling, I would consider changing my view, and that's the difference.

I would like to hear some of your "well placed" questions.

Survey Profiles Nonreligious Americans

philo777 »

Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:04 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

If anyone is interested, here is a link to the survey results on the Center For Inquiry (CFI) web site:

http://www.centerforinquiry.net/uploads/attachments/Profiles_of_the_Godless_FI_AugSept_Vol_29_No_5_pps_41-45.pdf

Survey Profiles Nonreligious Americans

philo777 »

Fri Aug 14, 2009 7:57 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

Interesting survey! If I was asked, I would identify myself as Atheist or Humanist, depending upon how the question was worded, and the results as I read them would pretty much fit my local chapter of The American Humanist Association (which I helped start).

Weekendman, you can forget the proselytizing. In my experience, most atheists/non-believers, or what ever you want to call us, reached that position after a great deal of investigation and thought. In my case, I have read a great deal about Christianity, and in my experience, I have met few Christians who know their religion as well as I know yours. Folks on this board excepted, of course, you tend to be the most knowledgeable.

I guess my point is, if studying everything that has come down to us written by the greatest Christian apologists has failed to provide compelling evidence for Christianity, what chance do you think you have of converting me or anyone else? I'm not saying it doesn't happen, just saying it is very rare for a convinced non-theist to "find jesus."

I guess I don't expect you to stop trying, though, it's what you do! And I really do realize that you think you are doing the "right thing."

If you folks want to keep Christianity going, you better get to work. Between the very rapid growth of atheism and the equally rapid growth of Islam, you have your work cut out for you. By the way, folks like me don't come on these boards hoping to convince anyone, we aren't that foolish or arrogant. I come here just in case there is a lurker who is questioning (as I once did) and doesn't think there is anyone else out there who feels the same way.

LifeWay: 1 in 7 Church Background Checks Uncover Criminal History

philo777 »

Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:04 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

"We respect that and the fact that a person has the right to repent and get their act together.... "

Absolutely! Why be good when you can be forgiven.

LifeWay: 1 in 7 Church Background Checks Uncover Criminal History

philo777 »

Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:59 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

Wow! I'm so glad they do this. Preying on children in ALL venues must end, and end now! What the Catholic church covered up, stonewalled and pretty much allowed to happen for a hundred years or more should have brought them down, and would have if they weren't so firmly entrenched.

This is a positive sign.