Updated 04:40 pm.EST, Sat November 21, 2009

Society|Fri, Jun. 19 2009 02:53 PM EDT

Huckabee, Jon Stewart Face Off on Abortion

By Nathan Black|Christian Post Reporter

Former Republican presidential candidate Mike Huckabee and late night host Jon Stewart faced off for the second time over another heated topic – abortion, or the pro-life issue, as Huckabee preferred to call it.

The debate Thursday night on "The Daily Show" didn't sway opinions but both parties demonstrated civility at a time when dialogue on abortion has become inflammatory, as Stewart noted.

"I hope that people begin to see that both sides can come at it with good faith and good intentions and are not frenzied and maniacal on one side and callous and indifferent on the other," said Stewart, who identifies more with the pro-choice camp but admitted he's in "the squishy middle" of the debate.

Huckabee, a Southern Baptist minister who debated gay marriage with Stewart in his last appearance on the political satire show, stood firm on his stance that life begins at conception and that every human life has intrinsic worth and value.

"There's an equality to human life. No one is worth more than another; no one is worth less than another," he said.

The real issue, he noted, is whether a person has a right to own another person.

"It does come down to the fundamental question: Do I have a right to say that I own another life to the point that I may dispose of it and consider it to be expendable," Huckabee said.

For Stewart and many pro-choice advocates, the question comes down to "Does the government have a right to tell a woman that she cannot make a decision about her reproductive health?"

In response, Huckabee argued that once there is life forming in a woman's womb, both of those lives must be considered.

Throughout the debate, Stewart alluded to the recent appeal made by President Barack Obama to find "common ground" on an issue where the views of both pro-life and pro-choice camps are irreconcilable.

Rather than rehashing old arguments in which both sides will not relent, Stewart suggested working together in areas such as education.

Before it becomes a crisis, where a woman comes to the point of considering abortion, Stewart suggested that pro-lifers "abandon" some core conservative principles such as abstinence only education and no contraception while also teaching the consequences of sexual behavior.

Huckabee responded, "I would be certainly favorable to anything that helps us preserve every human life and to treat it with dignity and worth."

The informal debate was even-tempered and both parties left the discussion agreeing that it is one of the most difficult issues but one that doesn't call for hostile arguments or violence.

"We don't need to shout at each other and we sure don't need to shoot each other," Huckabee said, referring to the recent shooting of late-term abortion provider George Tiller.

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  • Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:18 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Hey Steve...I have no idea why you were flagged. Maybe they didn't know the British word for checkers and thought it was something bad....

  • Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:17 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    "anti-choice crowd isn't satisfied until there are not limits whatsoever with abortions."

    The real question is to define choice. Choice without responsibility is foolishness. I'm not anti-choice...I'm pro-responsibility. People should be responsible for their sexuality. Ever heard the phrase "if you can't do the time...don't do the crime"? Last stats I saw said that less than 3% of abortions were the result of rape or insest. Therefore, 97% of abortions were a result of people not being responsible with their sexuality.

    People want to do what they want but not be responsible for the consequences. To me, those 97% are no better than those who drink and drive and "something bad happens".

  • Chas »
    Thu Jun 25, 2009 11:33 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Abortion = Killing the evidence of an immoral lifestyle.
    You notice you never hear about married women having abortions?

    It is only those who are in immoral sexual relationships that basically want the freedom to choose immorality, but not suffer the consequences of those decisions. No decision is without consequences.

    Abortion is always wrong in all cases. It is never right to murder an innocent human being.

  • Mon Jun 22, 2009 2:03 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Don't why I was flagged but my post said.."looks like checkmate to you Chelsa concerning weekender...maybe they are a draughts person". Hardly a flagging issue I think.

  • Sun Jun 21, 2009 6:55 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 3

    "To give up a little ground is ludicrous? Looks like you already have:"

    We've OFFERED to give up ground, Chelsea, but it's pointless because the anti-choice crowd isn't satisfied until there are not limits whatsoever with abortions.

    Re-read my post again. That's my point!!

  • Sun Jun 21, 2009 11:10 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Checkmate to you I believe Chelsa...maybe weekender is more of a draughts person. :-p hide

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 5:07 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Bcoontz,

    Your to be commended for making some difficult decisions iwth great ramifications for your whole family.

    I'm glad your enjoying your grandchildren and that your daught4er has made a good life for herself and them

    Good outcomes can come from bad mistakes and almost every family makes them. It what you do when the going gets tough that makes the difference.

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 4:23 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Danpat, Thanks for the condolences. I pray for them, but it's not easy. They've refused to let my wife and I see our grandchildren. No reason. No warning. No explanation. They refuse to take our calls or emails and send our gifts to the kids back in the mail.

    And we've done nothing. We don't discuss religion with them and we try never to be out of line. We're wonderful to the kids and visit them out of state 4 or 6 times a year. They haven't visited us in almost 5 years.
    We have tried to be involved in their lives even though they live far away and it's expensive ofr us. Then they d=just cut us off without a word after last Christmas.

    Nothing happened or has ever happened to warrant this kind of treatment, but there you have it. I strongly suspect it's because we don't fit in their little evangelical bubble. If that's it, I wish they had the honesty and the integrity to tell us that or to tell us something. But it seems that's two qualities they lack.

    We're haertbroken, but we're trying to forgive. It's hard, though. Any attempt we make to communicate is ignored. We've been fired as grandparents after 6 years of love and dedication to our babies. That's why I've got a bitter taste for people sho talk a lot about Jesus, but know nothing about how to live a Christian life. I put these evangelical relatives squarely in the hypocrite category. We're still willing to listen and forgive, but they won't even give us a chance.

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 4:12 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Weekender,

    To give up a little ground is ludicrous? Looks like you already have:

    "Most pro-lifers have been saying all along they would be willing to laws outlawing abortion except in cases such as rape, incest and when the life of the mother being in danger..."

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 4:12 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Nah, Steve, I don't compromise on the issue of life and neither does Governor Huckabee. :)

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 12:50 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    You to could learn from this debate weekender(and reading some of those below) as your post is everything that it was not.

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:53 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 3

    "With that starting point, if birth would seriously impair your wife's health with the strong probablility she would not survive, which life becomes truly immeasurably important?"

    Most pro-lifers have been saying all along that they would be willing to see laws outlawing abortion except in cases such as rape, incest and when the life of the mother being in danger (which, incidentally, almost never occurs).

    Unfortunately, the anti-life folks want government-funded abortions through all nine months (and even during birth) for whatever reason.

    For the pro-choice crowd to ask pro-lifers to give up a little ground is ludicrous.

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:41 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    People in general see more gray than black or white. In areas where we are at a loss, the word of God gives us the guidance that we need to understand and define the territory that we find ourselves upon. An extremely small number of abortions performed in the world have anything to do with the health of the mother and even in those cases there are usually alternatives. The only ones that don't fall into that category, from what I can tell, are ectopic and toxic shock pregnancies. So when I hear people defend abortion on the most extreme cases, it sounds disingenuous, because they are willing to throw out the lives of millions of people to save the lives of a relative few. Logic alone would dictate the opposite.

    Our household has quite a bit of experience with this issue. My wife, many years before we met, was forced by her parents to have an abortion when she was 16. In her most honest moments, she still wonders about that child, even over 30 years later. Our daughter when she was 16, despite using contraception, became pregnant. Despite all of us being distraught by the situation, and without pressure from me at that time (she already knew my position, I didn't feel I needed to repeat it) decided to keep the child. We raised this child as a family and as difficult as it has been, I can't imagine life without him. He is now eleven.

    Many years later, this same daughter was ordered off of birth control by the gynecologist to perform some procedure, I'm not sure what, and she became pregnant again. Again, though distraught, she knew what the right thing to do was and now we have a 2 year old granddaughter that all of us love and enjoy very much. My daughter recently married a great guy, who loves her and her children very much.

    Though we made many mistakes as parents and she made many mistakes, we lived with the consequences, respecting the life that had been given to us as a trust, and we are now truly blessed. I hope this helps someone wrestling with a decision only made harder by the fact that abortion is legal.

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 2:33 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    hello dannyboy...

    You could learn from this debate, have you noticed how the two of them don't get into name calling or polarising people as if they just see the matter as black and white or don't struggle with it. It's quite easy to sit at a keyboard and call people "liberals" or "Catholic In Name Only" but my experince is that people cannot be placed in boxes so easily and that many ordianary people(whom I guess you don't know) see both sides and feel its not right to come dowm firmly on only one siade because as chelsa says earlier, life throws us curves. Take me for example I'm not happy with abortion as just a method of contraception (without good reason) but when my daughter had sex for the first time and the condom came off, I got her the morning after pill straight away with not even a minutes thought, that's the reason why we took the approach I mention earlier to them regarding sex etc..(and yes we made sure she went on the pill). Life can change one's actions sometimes, it can rounden the corners of the personality

    On another note maybe you can help me..I once had a discussion with my priest about those in the parish who called others Catholic In Name Only, all he would say was that they considered themselves to have special gravy, and laughed. Any thoughts what he meant?

    Thanks

    Steve

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 12:37 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    "and contraception combined with teaching the consequences of sexual behavior is a good solid approach and one which would lead to a decrease in abortion."

    Yah, right. This is why by 2050 the whole world will be Muslim. As Kaddafi just said,...We don't even need to fire a shot; we'll just go in and vote their governments out. He is correct on this (unfortunately)

    Liberals do not want a "decrease in abortion." They have been saying this since 1960. The total number of all pregnancy-related deaths in 1960 was 1579 v. over 50,000,000 today. Keeping abortions legal and safe and to a minimum is the code words the Planned Parenthood who got $ 300,000,000 of our tax money last year, and the Queen Hillary of abortion uses these terms consistently. Even Roe of Roe v. Wade does not agree with abortion.

    Pro-abortion forces typically exaggerate the number of abortions performed prior to legalization and paint a dreadful historical picture where millions of desperate women met their demise at the hands of quack abortionists until legalization made the procedure safe. Pro-life proponents often labor under a misconception that abortion was always illegal and rare in this country.

    Yet, abortion is the seminal moral issue of our time. Nearly 50 million unborn babies have been murdered since Roe v. Wade legalized abortion in 1973. If one includes Europe, the number of dead fetuses is staggering. Abortion has claimed more victims than either of the two great totalitarian ideologies of the 20th century, communism and Nazism.

    Both Pope Benedict and the late Pope John Paul II have not only decried abortion as state-sanctioned infanticide, but explicitly - and repeatedly - said it must be outlawed: There can be no compromise with such monstrous barbarism. Abortion is akin to the Jewish question in Europe during the 1930s: Should an entire class of people be denied their essential humanity?

    It is not an "issue;" it is a human life with the same constitutional rights we have. It is a human rights issue and I am surprised so many of our black brethern look the other way after their experience with slavery [what was it 96% of blacks voted for Obama who has the worst record in history of a US president on that he believes not only in abortion but in infanticide).
    Forty six per cent of Catholics voted for this abortion president which is mind-boggling considering the position of their Church (CINOs - Catholic in Name Only)

  • Sat Jun 20, 2009 12:17 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Ah, Cheisa, Cheisa: I found you again, mon petit fleur. On another post I read about your relatives, so:

    "I have come to set a man against his father, a daughter against her mother. Your enemies will be the members of your own household." --MT 10:35-36

    So often we are blessed with dunderheads. I have many in my own family. All we can do is pray for them. God Bless.
    My Irish father always said aloud: "God has blessed me with the three dumbest sons in the world."

    Not sure if this is a compliment (you know being a "blessing?."

  • Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:56 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    Post: "where do God and sin come into all of this,? Or do they come into it at all.?"

    Easy answer, perhaps easy night - but I doubt it.

    "Thou shalt not kill." God - Sin Bible:

    "This is what the Lord says- He who made you, who formed you in the womb, and who will help you" --Isaiah 44:2

    "For You created my innermost being; You knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise You because I am fearfully and wonderfully made." --Psalm 139:13-14

    "Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me." --Psalm 51:5

    "Sons are a heritage from the Lord, children a reward from Him." --Psalm 127:3

    "Defend the cause of the weak and fatherless...Rescue the weak and needy." --Psalm 82:3-4

    "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you." --Jeremiah 1:5 (NIV)

    "I have come that they may have life, and have it to the fullest." --Jesus Christ (John 10:10)

    "Rescue those being led away to death." --Proverbs 24:11 (NIV)

    Talking about John the Baptist, "and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even from his mother's womb." --Luke 1:15(NIV) There is no record of the Holy Spirit ever filling anything but a person.

    "Before I was born the Lord called me..." "And now the Lord says-He who formed me in the womb to be His servant..." --Isaiah 49:1,5

    The apostle Paul says "But when God, who set me apart from my mother's womb and called me by His grace..." --Galatians 1:15(NIV)

    "Do no harm." Medical Profession

    With the advent of the science of DNA, we no longer see "why this isn't a baby; it's just a glob."

    "Practise no magic, sorcery, or infanticide. _Didache

    Gee, I'm windy tonight... Go babies

  • Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:55 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

    Bottom line difference:

    Christian worldview vs. secular humanist view

    All the major differences stem from this dramatic gap.

    Truth based on Scripture vs. moral relativism.

  • Chaz »
    Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:15 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Chelsa,

    I didn't say that "all humans are immeasurably important" is the starting point as implied in your post. I wrote that "we start with Him." Consequently what is "morally right" is to listen to Him. What is "morally wrong" is to not to. Moral issues are not "our decision." It is precisely because we take ownership of them and of life that we sink into the grey swamp.

    "Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life." John 8:12 I believe that is true for every single decision we will ever face without exception.

  • Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:32 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    This debate was a good example, as others have noticed, that demonizing the other side, which seems to happen more over this particular issue then any other, does absolutely no good.

    I personally agree with Stewart's position, but I can understand Huck's position too and appreciate his viewpoint. My prognosis is that we will all limp along in this debate for the foreseeable future as there is no resolution in site.

  • artm »
    Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:23 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    where do God and sin come into all of this,? Or do they come into it at all.?

  • Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:58 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Kudos, again, to Jon Stewart. Whether his guest is a conservative or liberal, he conducts himself with civility and respect for his guest. He might disagree with his guest, but he never gets into a Bill Riley style shouting match and tries to see the other side of the story. His interviews with Huckabee have been refreshing food for thought.

    He's not afraid to confront, either, like when he roasted Jim Cramer over the Wall Street banking mess, but he does it with humor and honesty. He calls a spade a spade and asks the tough questions. If you get the Comedy Channel, tune in.

  • Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:52 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 3

    Yes, all humans are immeasurably important. With that starting point, if birth would seriously impair your wife's health with the strong probablility she would not survive, which life becomes truly immeasurably important?

    You see, the starting point is a good one, but life can throw us some curves where our decision isn't simply a moral right or wrong one. It's complicated and nuanced, not black and white. Both sides in this argument try to remove the remove the colors and make it black or white when it's actually gut wrenching for all involved.

  • Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:28 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    This sounds like an excellent discussion(and one maybe some on CP could learn from?). I think that Stewarts approach concerning abstinence only education and contraception combined with teaching the consequences of sexual behavior is a good solid approach and one which would lead to a decrease in abortion. Such an approach is one we have taken with our kids and it seems to have served them well.

  • Chaz »
    Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:19 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

    I don't see this as an issue of the "government" dictating anything to anybody. It is about starting points for reason and morality.

    If our starting point is other than God and we are going to reason and moralize about life to the exclusion of God then, frankly, nothing matters: not you, not me, not the unborn, not being good, not being evil, NOTHING. Let us eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow we die. (Dr. Tiller's work, for example, was perfectly consistent and logical in a godless world.)

    But if God is there and He has revealed Himself in nature and the Christian Scriptures and we start with Him, EVERYTHING matters.

    And considering that this God has made it exceedingly clear that all things human are immeasurably important to Him then questions concerning to abort or not are not even in the ball park. NOT EVEN CLOSE. What IS in order is fear and trembling at the very thought of mismanaging anything, especially anything and anyone who is vulnerable. "Religion that is pure and undefiled before God, the Father, is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world." James 1:27

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