Saturday, November 07, 2009 Last Update:07:14 pm ET

Society|Tue, Jun. 30 2009 11:24 AM EDT

Obama Pledges to Ally with Gays for More 'Progress'

By Nathan Black|Christian Post Reporter

President Barack Obama reiterated his pro-gay pledges to the homosexual community during a White House reception Monday.

Addressing hundreds of gays and lesbians and advocates at an event marking the 40th anniversary of the birth of the gay rights movement, Obama vowed again to overturn the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy and to repeal the federal Defense of Marriage Act.

"I will not only be your friend, I will continue to be an ally and a champion and a president who fights with you and for you," he told an enthusiastic crowd.

The event was a first-of-its-kind Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender Pride Month reception at the White House. Obama declared June 2009 LGBT Pride Month and was the first president to use the term transgender in his proclamation.

His predecessor, George W. Bush, never issued an LGBT proclamation during his eight years in office.

Pro-family groups say Obama's homosexual political agenda is unprecedented and warn of his "full-throated attack" on the moral and social order, as Robert Knight of Coral Ridge Ministries stated.

Knight along with other conservative groups, including Americans For Truth About Homosexuality, believe a fulfillment of the pro-gay agenda would usher in an era of intolerance toward Christians.

If fulfilled, Obama's promises to the homosexual community "will undermine the freedoms of the majority of Americans who affirm marriage and healthy, time-tested Judeo-Christian sexual values in their daily lives," AFTAH said in a statement.

For gay rights advocates, progress has been slow and many have become impatient with the Obama administration.

Some expressed outrage when the Justice Department filed a motion this month to dismiss a gay couple's lawsuit against the Defense of Marriage Act – which defines marriage as a legal union between one man and one woman for purposes of all federal laws, and provides that states need not recognize same-sex marriages from another state. The department made arguments defending DOMA in its motion.

But on Monday, Obama made clear that he has a duty to uphold existing law. However, fulfilling this duty does not lessen his commitment to reversing DOMA, he said.

He also reassured them that they will continue to make progress and by the end of his term, he believes the homosexual community will "have pretty good feelings about the Obama administration."

"We have made progress and we will make more," he said.

Earlier this month, Obama signed a memorandum to extend some benefits to gay and lesbian partners of federal employees.

The president noted, "Even as we face extraordinary challenges as a nation we cannot and will not put aside issues of basic equality."

Among other vows, Obama said he is urging Congress to pass the Domestic Partners Benefits and Obligations Act to guarantee the full range of benefits to LGBT couples and their children. He is also working to pass the employee non-discrimination bill as well as the hate crimes bill which would expand federal protections to the LGBT community.

Conservative and Christian groups have been actively campaigning against the hate crimes bill and urging senators to reject the legislation. They contend that the bill, which adds "sexual orientation" and "gender identity" alongside "race," "color" or "national origin," would be used to prosecute those who speak against homosexuality because they can be blamed for inciting violence. The groups also argue that there is simply no need for such legislation as existing state laws are already sufficient.

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  • Tue Aug 18, 2009 2:54 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 3

    GOD HATES ALL SIN...JESUS DIED FOR THE SIN OF THE WORLD! This world stands condemned...and the only hope for anyone is JESUS CHRIST!!!

    God is HOLY...and sin keeps us from intimacy with GOD!!!! Man wants to bring the flesh, and every unholy thing before our Holy God! Man was created in HIS IMAGE! In CHRIST we are new creations....the old dies...including all sinful habits...after time..the things that used to be OK are no longer okay....in my heart...I DO NOT WANT TO SIN!
    God is the one who tells us what SIN is...we do not define what it is...but in the latter days...MANKIND WILL BECOME LOVERS OF SELF...DENYING THE VERY ONE WHO CREATED THEM..WHY...THEY ARE LOVERS OF SELF...AND PRACTICE EVERY KIND OF INIQUITY, THEY HAVE ITCHING EARS, AND RAISE UP TEACHERS AND PREACHERS WHO TELL THEM WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR! I AM NOT ASHAMED OF THE GOSPEL OF JESUS CHRIST, IT IS A STENCH TO THOSE WHO ARE PERISHING BUT IT IS THE POWER OF GOD UNTO SALVATION FOR ALL WHO BELIEVE!

  • Wed Jul 08, 2009 6:15 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    CP-"Thank you for your e-mail. We have added a new function to the comment section. Users who want to view flagged comments can do so now, by clicking (show)."

    Yay! Thank you CP!!!

    (Not exactly what I was hoping for, I'd like for the flaggers id to be posted... but hey it's a good start!!)

  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 10:14 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Miracles of Miracles, the new CP flagging program, something that everybody agrees on!!!!!!!!!!

  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 9:49 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show JH: "This is awesome! We can read all the flagged posts!!" It is a vast improvement over the system I've been using to save my posts so that they can easily be reposted. Now the board software is saving my posts for me, including some posts I had thought were long lost. The problem of it being easier to flag than to post remains however. Without some form of accountability some will probably continue to abuse flagging. I agree that the new feature is awesome. Well done CP! hide

  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 9:28 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    This is awesome! We can read all the flagged posts!!

  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 8:54 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:45 pm : 0 : 0 Flag Delete believer: "But to the best of my knowledge David did prophecy but never held the position or office of Prophet". I got my information from wikipedia. If the information is wrong please consider making appropriate corrections to the wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophets_of_Christianity hide

  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:05 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    From a christian perspective I get the whole God Ordained line of thinking, and I respect it. However, not everyone in this country or the world for that matter are christian or follow the christian belief system or believe gay marriage is wrong. I think respect is needed on both sides of the fence - the religious and the secular. It is possible to give to 'Caesar what is Caesar's' and not violate religious law. A church does not have to perform or bless gay marriages, and private schools do not have to (or should not have to) bend to secular law etc. And there is no reason why the same respect can't go the opposite direction.

  • Tue Jul 07, 2009 12:54 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I saw a post from Mike on another thread.

  • Mon Jul 06, 2009 3:32 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I wonder how Mike85 and HM are doing..... :O)

  • Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:06 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    ID, plus that same passage is quoted in Mark 10:5-9 and Ephesians 4:31. And considering God ordains no other form of marriage it should be obvious what His original and only design for marriage is.

  • Mon Jul 06, 2009 11:50 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    How some of you miss God's design for marriage is puzzling. Gen. 1:27, 5:2, and Matthew 19:4-6 clearly give God's design for marriage. God in the flesh, Jesus, quoted the two Genesis passages in Matt. 19:4-6. How can one miss the clarity of those passages and claim that God never gave the design? By the way, He created us physically, emothionally, and spiritually to be a team in marriage, man and woman. It seems obvious from the passages and from biology.

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:04 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    "In response: I asked for SECULAR reasons not ideology based position statements.
    So I ask again what are the secular reasons(non-religious based)that can be shown to be valid and not just rely upon your religious beliefs. "


    You're going to have to stop being so intolerant and closed minded if you are going to increase your knowledge and understanding. Your points of reference are quite limited and do not allow the understanding that is brought from an open mind. :D

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:03 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show When Jehovah gets flagged on a Christian blog it's obvious the homo trolls need to be restrained. hide

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 2:33 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    al, let me be more blunt, your challenge is a joke at best since true Christians don't leave their spiritual convictions at home or church and once again we do not view the secular and spiritual as two separate entities, they are one in the same when in comes to our daily living so of course our biblical worldview will always impact our views with regards to the secular world and the reality is so what if we bring our biblical worldview into the discussion. Your challenge sounds like what one would hear on the school playground, "but I bet you can't do it with one hand tied behind your back?"

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 1:43 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "Didn't your professors teach you that some internet sources are inaccurate at best and skewed or dishonest at worst? "

    I do a google on the subject and check several sources. Many of them match up when it comes to Luther including source material.

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 12:52 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 1

    The Secular Case Against Gay Marriage
    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1082190/posts

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 12:22 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    believer »Sun Jul 05, 2009 7:07 am al, the problem with your challenge is that you appear to assume there is a spiritual realm and a secular realm that are totally separate of each other and that neither realm impacts the other side and while in some cases that may be true in many cases that is not true and this is one case where it is not true. God's Word says that He honors the nation whose leaders honor Him and He blesses nations that obey Him, so when laws are passed that violate God's standards we dishonor God and in turn He may either remove His hand of protection from us and even bring His judgement on us or both. And while our personal sin has negative consequences on us and even on those around us, the sins of a nation have negative consequences on us as a nation and that's why we as God's people are compelled to stand against anything that dishonors God by endorsing practices that willfully violate God's Word.
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    In response: I asked for SECULAR reasons not ideology based position statements.
    So I ask again what are the secular reasons(non-religious based)that can be shown to be valid and not just rely upon your religious beliefs.

    http://alockslee.blogspot.com/You can post here too

    TFR

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 7:07 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    al, the problem with your challenge is that you appear to assume there is a spiritual realm and a secular realm that are totally separate of each other and that neither realm impacts the other side and while in some cases that may be true in many cases that is not true and this is one case where it is not true. God's Word says that He honors the nation whose leaders honor Him and He blesses nations that obey Him, so when laws are passed that violate God's standards we dishonor God and in turn He may either remove His hand of protection from us and even bring His judgement on us or both. And while our personal sin has negative consequences on us and even on those around us, the sins of a nation have negative consequences on us as a nation and that's why we as God's people are compelled to stand against anything that dishonors God by endorsing practices that willfully violate God's Word.

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 6:42 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Jehovahnissi and me don't agree on everything, but I have never yet seen a post by them that needs to be flagged, so something really needs to be done about this.

  • Sun Jul 05, 2009 2:15 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    I would rally like for someone to explain what actual "undermining would occur if full equality were given to the LGBT community? Please do so and list the secular reasons, not the religious ideology.

    I understand the position of those who feel their religious values are somehow threatened but seriously, if a person has equality and it able to simply be able to exist what is the harm to any fundamentalist or evangelical?

    http://alockslee.blogspot.com/ You can respond here too
    TFR

  • Sat Jul 04, 2009 7:38 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    This flagging is ubelievable!...

  • Sat Jul 04, 2009 4:26 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Re: wikipedia as a source -
    Didn't your professors teach you that some internet sources are inaccurate at best and skewed or dishonest at worst?

  • Sat Jul 04, 2009 3:42 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Luther's attitude toward the Jews changed over his life. In his earlier period, until around 1536, he expressed concern for their situation and was enthusiastic at the prospect of converting them to Christianity, but in his later period, he denounced them and urged their harsh persecution and even murder. In 'On the Jews and Their Lies', Luther made a number of accusations against the Jews: "In the first place, they defame our Lord Jesus Christ, calling him a sorcerer and tool of the devil.[35] This they do because they cannot deny his miracles. Thus they imitate their forefathers, who said, 'He casts out demons by Beelzebub, the prince of demons' Luke 11:15." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Jews_and_Their_Lies --------------------------------------------------------- Jewish History Sourcebook http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/jewish/jewishsbook.html God bless His chosen people! (ROM 11) hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:13 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "Luther said some horrible things about the Jews."

    Of that I have no doubt. There was quite the war of words between the Christian world and the Jewish world in those days. Some of what was said by the Jews wasn't exactly nice either as you can see from some of Luther's statements.

    Keep in mind that Luther came out of the Catholosism of the day which wasn't exactly passive in it's own right. People tied their "honor" to their faith. Today, we understand that Christianity means to die to self and live the life Jesus has for us. Luther learned quite a bit about true Christianity but his one life wasn't enough to shed all the baggage.

    Truely a shame.

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 9:57 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show "The holocaust was no accident, but the logical outcome of the two thousand years of history that preceded it. Hitler did nothing really new. Only the scale was different. Jews could never again feel secure in Europe (or really anywhere else), only in a state of their own. For many years after Israel was founded in 1948, recruits to the Israeli army were sworn in atop the mountain fortress of Masada beside the Dead Sea at dawn where Jewish rebels against Rome had taken their last stand in 73 C.E. There they pledged that "Masada will never fall again." Persecution of the Jews in Europe http://www.nmhschool.org/tthornton/mehistorydatabase/christian_persecution_of_the_jew.php ------------------------------------------------------ Romans 11 The rejection of the Jews is not universal. (1-10) God overruled their unbelief for making the Gentiles partakers of gospel privileges. (11-21) The Gentiles cautioned against pride and unbelief, The Jews shall be called as a nation, and brought into God's visible covenant again. (22-32) A solemn adoring of the wisdom, goodness, and justice of God. (33-36) Rom 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: Rom 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. Rom 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable [are] hHs judgments, and His ways past finding out! Rom 11:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been His counsellor? Rom 11:35 Or who hath first given to Him, and it shall be recompensed unto Him again? Rom 11:36 For of Him, and through Him, and to Him, [are] all things: to whom [be] glory for ever. Amen. hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 9:09 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Danliel P
    Luther said some horrible things about the Jews. If you are unaware of it you can easily find them as well as the ongoing attempt to excuse his statements.

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 8:21 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "And for those that didn't convert, Luther would have____?? "

    From what I read of his quotes he was against what the Jews had to say about Christianity. He didn't like the lies that were going around in Jewish circles of the day. There's nothing I found in his quotes that suggests he would prefer them dead or anything like that.

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 7:30 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    DP

    << "The Nazis imprisoned and killed Jews who had converted to Christianity: Luther would have welcomed them.">>

    And for those that didn't convert, Luther would have____??

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 6:20 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    You will find an interesting write-up on Martin Luther and his anti-semitic beliefs at this site:

    http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/anti-semitism/Luther_on_Jews.html

    One interesting comment is "The Nazis imprisoned and killed Jews who had converted to Christianity: Luther would have welcomed them."

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:58 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show rachel << johnzon, I'm past caring, it's a bit childish.....>> I'm a bit disappointed, I was hoping you would finally get it... hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:36 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show ''You still dont get it........'' johnzon, I'm past caring, it's a bit childish...... hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:41 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show jehov << And in the end is all for the glory of Almighty God.>> What does that mean. Does God require glorification by lowly humans. Does your comment mean God's ego requires stroking? Just asking....... hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:36 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show jehov << The battle really is a spiritual one.. >> Well, if that works for you, good. <<and it goes far back before time.>> Before time?? What does that mean?? What is before time? Was there a time when time did not exist? Are you referring to before the theoretical singularity of the universe? hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:27 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 2

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Johnzon, The battle really is a spiritual one and it goes far back before time. THe holocaust was prophesied to happen. And who prophesied? THe prophets of GOD. ALL that GOd has decreed will take place in time. History is His story. And in the end is all for the glory of Almighty God. hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:15 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Jehov I took a look at the link you provided. Looks like it blames the devil. To borrow a quote from Flip Wilson " The devil made me do it".......LOL Did Martin Luther partner with satan? hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:03 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Why did the Jewish Holocaust occur? http://www.iesouschristos.com/holocaust.htm hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 11:58 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    DP

    Let me help you on your history lesson, starting with a link on Martin Luther's antisemitism:

    http://nobeliefs.com/luther.htm

    I can point you to many more if you wish, his antisemitism is well documented- by his own writings.......

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 11:48 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    DP

    << Truth be known many a Christian has died in wars defending the Jews>>

    I agree, atheists and agnostics too.

    What you miss however, the history is very well documented that antisemitism among Christians for centuries in Europe led to persecution and violence against Jews. Martin Luther vilified Jews as well as large numbers of Catholic clerics. Hitler was able to exploit that existing antisemitism that lead to the murder of millions of European Jews. Thats a fact. I suggest you study up on history a bit....

    "Those that forget the past are doomed to repeat it"

    George Santayana

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 11:32 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Rom 12:3...For through the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think more highly of himself than he ought to think; but to think so as to have sound judgment, as God has allotted to each a measure of faith. Phil 2:13 .....for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose. Heb 13:21....equip you in every good thing to do His will, working in us that which is pleasing in His sight, through Jesus Christ, to whom be the glory forever and ever. Amen. Soli Deo GLoria hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 11:30 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "The Jews of Europe were vilified due largely to Christian antisemitism which lead to hatred and violence against Jews for centuries. "

    So, why is that what was viewed as a "Christian nation" came to the defense of the Jews and still does to this day (...well until Obama took office)?

    It is christohumanism that taught those things. I'm sure it fits your beliefs better to blame Christianity for those things but...no. The book of Hebrews was written to...the Hebrews (Jews). It isn't even logical to blame those who believe the Bible as written for the attack against the Jews.

    Truth be known many a Christian has died in wars defending the Jews. Your arguement is non-sequiter.

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:41 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    rev, no sweat and my apology for the misread, but I still disagree with your view that one man and one woman is not God's original and only design for marriage and your example of using the life examples of the prophets doesn't fit. Because when we read what some of these prophets did in their personal lives, they resembled anything but a godly life and in fact many were killed by God for their sinful examples. Although not prophets the sons of the High Priest Eli, who were priests themselves, are a good example of why we shouldn't look up to a person simply because of the position they hold. Plus, once again if we look at the results of David living a polygamous lifestyle we see nothing but serious negative consequences and as I shared earlier, we see serious negative consequences in each of the polygamous relationships mentioned in the Old Testament. The bottomline is that just because those in authority be it political, spiritual, or military practice something does not necessarily mean God is okay with it and more specifically ordains it.

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:30 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show To whom did CHrist lay down His life for? John 10:14-18 (14)I am the good shepherd; and I know My own, and My own know Me, (15) even as the Father knows Me and I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. (16) And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they shall hear My voice; and they shall become one flock with one shepherd. (17) For this reason the Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again. (18) No one has taken it away from Me, but I lay it down on My own initiative. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This commandment I received from My Father. ------------------------------------------------------- hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:29 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show rachel << Not real Christians and no Christian wants to harm any homosexual, they only want them to repent and be saved, how is that harming them.>> Oh, its only that fake Christians that are the problem....LOL. You still dont get it........ hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:27 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show ''The Jews of Europe were vilified due largely to Christian antisemitism which lead to hatred and violence against Jews for centuries. Some of the same language I see against homosexuals by Christians is not all that much different than that expressed against Jews. Many Christians really should be ashamed of themselves for their conduct.'' Not real Christians and no Christian wants to harm any homosexual, they only want them to repent and be saved, how is that harming them. hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:24 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. That gift is offered to everyone, it's up to them if they accept that gift, or reject it. No man will have any excuse on the day of Judgement. hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:19 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Flagged as inappropriate. show rachel << So explain your point for stupid people like me!>> The Jews of Europe were vilified due largely to Christian antisemitism which lead to hatred and violence against Jews for centuries. Some of the same language I see against homosexuals by Christians is not all that much different than that expressed against Jews. Many Christians really should be ashamed of themselves for their conduct. hide

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:17 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    "We are bound always to give thanks to God for you, brethren, beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth." (2 Thess. 2:13)

    The mission of the Spirit in the earth is to apply to God's elect the redemption proposed by God the Father and purchased by God the Son for them. The Holy Spirit is here to make good the souls of the heirs of glory the fruits of the travail of Christ's soul.

    This He does by means of the Gospel by the written and oral ministry of the Scripture, for the Word of God is the only instrument He employs or uses. The Word of God is "the word of life" (Phil. 2:16), but it only becomes such in the experience of the individual soul by the immediate operation and application of the Spirit of God.

    As Paul wrote to the Thessalonian saints, "For our Gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Spirit." (1 Thess. 1:5) This is not to deny the efficacy of the Word itself, but it is to insist that the direct agency of the Spirit on the heart is absolutely necessary in order to the reception of the Word. The Word is a lamp unto our path, but there must be an opening of the eyes of our understandings by the Spirit before we can see its light.

    The salvation of God's elect was purposed, planned, and provided by God the Father before the foundation of the world. It was procured and secured by the incarnation, obedience, death and resurrection of God the Son. It is made known, applied to and wrought in them by God the Spirit. Thus, "Salvation is of the Lord" (Jonah 2:9), and man has no part or hand in it at any point whatsoever. The child of God is not the earner but the recipient of it. Faith is not a condition which the elect sinner must perform in order to obtain salvation, but is the means and channel through which he personally enjoys the salvation of the Triune Jehovah.


    A.W.Pink
    --------------------------------------------------------

    Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:
    Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
    Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:06 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    "Calvinism teaches false doctrine, please don't believe it, or you may think it is too late for you"

    Actually, many Calvinists teach false doctrine and even twist Calvinism to do it! Many use Calvinism to force legalism on people when, in fact, Calvanism (which is based on the Doctrines of Grace) free people from legalism. Many Calvinists teach predestination like it locks people out or can be used as an excuse for not accepting Christ. However, the Bible says:

    1Ti 2:3-4 For this [is] good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
    Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

    The doctrine is actually called "Unconditional Election" which says:

    "The doctrine of unconditional election asserts that God's choice from eternity of those whom he will bring to himself is not based on foreseen virtue, merit, or faith in those people. Rather, it is unconditionally grounded in God's mercy alone."

    Please note the choice if "from eternity" which is where God dwells outside of our liner time.

    There are many who believe themselves to be "predestined" who will be quite surprised on the day of judgement.

    Salvation comes for those who humble themselves to see who they truely are in the sight of God without Jesus. No one is saved without the grace and mercy of God. This is why there is no salvation under the law. God must provide grace and mercy through the blood of Jesus for us to be saved.

    Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 9:46 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    ''FYI, My comments are sarcastic''

    They are!

  • Fri Jul 03, 2009 9:46 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    You are Arminian?

    No. :)

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