Updated 02:59 pm.EST, Fri November 20, 2009

Education|Wed, Sep. 30 2009 11:20 AM EDT

Ga. Community Defends Bible Verses in Football Games

By Nathan Black|Christian Post Reporter

Hundreds of people joined a rally Tuesday night to support Lakeview-Fort Oglethorpe High School cheerleaders and their right to paint Bible verses on banners.

The signs, which the Georgia school football team has run through for years, were banned last week over a complaint that the banners promoted religion.

LFO senior cheerleader Taylor Guinn said they're being silenced for what they believe in.

"It was heartbreaking to know that our school system is just conforming to the nonbelievers and letting them have their way when there’s so many more people wanting the signs," Guinn said, according to Chattanooga Times Free Press. "Our freedom of speech and freedom of religion is being taken away."

Catoosa County Schools Superintendent Denia Reese appreciates the cheerleaders expressing their Christian values. But after receiving the complaint, she determined that the biblical banners violated the First Amendment.

"It broke my heart to have to tell those girls that they could not display that message on the football field," Reese told WDEF News. "The location inside the football field creates the impression that the school system is endorsing that particular religious message."

She has allowed the signs to be displayed in a designated area outside the football stadium.

Writing Bible verses on run-through banners has been a tradition at the high school for years.

According to Susan Bradley, one of the cheerleaders' coaches, the signs have been well received by the football team and the community.

"It’s just kind of a positive message that seems to have been appreciated by the community and by the school," the coach told Chattanooga Times Free Press. "It seems like it was something that everybody was in unison about, so there was no problem."

The community showed its support when more than 500 showed up at Tuesday's rally. Thousands are also backing the cheerleaders on Facebook.

"What happened at LFO is terrible!" said Brad Scott, a local youth pastor and president of the LFO Class of 2004, who claims the same incident happened during his high school years.

"We stood up for our rights and this issue was defeated through grassroots efforts. Time to do it again!" the youth pastor said on the Facebook page he created.

LFO Principal Jerry Ransom supports the banners but said the school has to "adhere to what the Supreme Court and federal courts have ruled on."

For Jeremy Jones, another local youth pastor, the First Amendment is a two-way street.

“Our Constitution does guarantee that our federal government will not establish a religion. It will also make sure that we are allowed to exercise it without interference from the government,” Jones told the Times Free Press.

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  • Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:33 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 0

    Look unless the principal, coach, or teacher, or any employee of the school specificially told them to make the posters, this is an example of free speech. I certainly wouldn't have a problem if a group of Islamic students made a sign quoting the Quran. If this gets denied what's next no John 3:16 signs at prowrestling events???

  • Thu Oct 08, 2009 3:06 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Believer,

    I lived in central PA for about 5 months and I have a lot of family in western PA. It definitely is a beautiful state! Wasn't impressed with living there, but I liked driving through it. :)

  • Thu Oct 08, 2009 1:41 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    aramantha, I like the weather around Gettysburg PA, it sounds like what you said about parts of VA. You get all four seasons but not too much of any!!

  • Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:00 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Very true, Believer! We have the same "seasons" here. lol When I lived in Las Vegas, an area about 20 minutes north of where I lived - called Summerlin - actually received about an inch or two of snow. Where we were, it was 65-70 degrees out. People who lived in the area were sent home from work early. haha It was bizarre but, like you said, no one knew how to function in it. It's not like Las Vegas keeps plows on the ready! Coming from here, I was like "Oh my gosh, people!!" It was somewhat entertaining if you didn't have anywhere to go.

    I like Virginia. You get all 4 seasons, but no real extremes of any. That's what I want. Or, I'm good with living in the desert. I just really hate cold weather!

  • Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:48 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    aramantha, I like snow for about two to three months, believe it or not I love shoveling snow. But here it snows an inch and the whole place shuts down. I mean if we're going to have snow, then let's have some snow!!! But at the same time it can overstay it's welcome as in the North Country where I lived, where we had four seasons, almost winter, winter, still winter, and road construction!! What I don't miss is the frigid cold when you hear it's going to get up to zero and you think that's warm weather!!!

  • Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:27 am Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Believer,

    What's wrong with you?! How can you miss all that snow?! I can't wait to get away from it! lol I live in a suburb of Albany, NY. I think snow is great in pictures and would be ok if it naturally appeared warm and only fell on trees and houses. No shoveling and plowing that way! Just the beauty of snow covered landscapes. Alas, it is only a dream.... hahaha

    I'm trying to find a new job to transfer to somewhere down south where it's at least warmer.

    :)

  • Wed Oct 07, 2009 9:22 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    DP, yes, and I miss all the snow terribly at times!!!

  • Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:13 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    " I was born and raised in Rochester"

    The home of RTI and 10 feet of snow....

  • Wed Oct 07, 2009 3:42 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    amaranth, where do you live in Upstate New York, I was born and raised in Rochester and pastored a church in Philadelphia and we lived in Theresa? As for your post that is the exact points I made to viking, that even though cheerleading is a part of the school most if not all their funding is raised by them. So they almost sound like a paraschool organization as opposed to an official school organization.

  • Wed Oct 07, 2009 11:32 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    "I press toward the "goal" for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus."

    ...and you say I'm a wag.... :D

    The Bible also says that King David had a motorcycle. It says that David's Triumph rode throughout the land....

  • Wed Oct 07, 2009 11:28 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    I was a cheerleader in middle school and had several friends on the squad in high school. Some were conformists, but not all of them. I didn't fit into any group and had friends in every "clique." So, thank you for that generalization by the "You can only be considered intelligent if you think and act like me" atheist.

    :)

    All of our uniforms were paid for by US. All signs were paid for by US. I'm sure we received discounts from the uniform people for ordering as a school, but all funding for our uniforms and signs came from our parents' pockets - NOT the school. Maybe this is different at other schools, but that's how it is at all the schools in the Upstate NY area that I live in - there are about 15 high schools (if not more) in a one hour radius of me.

  • Wed Oct 07, 2009 3:21 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    The intresting thing here is that StPaul loved soccer not football, we know this because of what he wrote to the Phillipians....

    I press toward the "goal" for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.

    Nuff said, your watching the wrong game.

  • Tue Oct 06, 2009 9:05 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    DP hi actually I agree with your position. I was only comment on the logical extension of Rockn's post.

  • Tue Oct 06, 2009 10:48 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    U4eah,

    I'm glad you speak on their behalf. They are so fortunate to have someone like you, who doesn't even know their names, telling the world why they did what they did. ROFL.

  • Tue Oct 06, 2009 10:41 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 3

    To try to assert that a bunch of cheerleaders in school uniform in a school stadium holding a banner with a Bible verse on it for a school scheduled and funded activity doesn't violate the many court decisions on separation of church and state and covering religious speech at school activities is delusional. Of course this should have been stopped years ago.

    If you know anything about the culture of cheerleaders you would know that they are first and foremost conformists and have getting along with the group as their primary goal. So that the idea that these kids are not coerced into this behavior by peer pressure and desire for acceptance is also ludicrous. The first girl to speak against would be out ASAP.

    Chicago - Y'all best stay out of Texas with ideas like banning football are less accepted than being an atheist

  • Mon Oct 05, 2009 7:45 pm Agree: 8   Disagree: 0

    " it would be against the will of god to oppose such rulings of the authorities set over us. "

    Let's see if we can expand your understanding of America. Here in the United States each voter is the government. We are the authority over us. Government works for us. Therefore, it is our responsibility as Americans in authority over ourselves to take whatever action is required to run our country.

    Our courts do not rule over us. They are to make rulings for us. If they make a mistake it is the responsibility of citizens to fix the problem....

  • Sat Oct 03, 2009 5:42 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Rockn
    Hi by your logic of coursse it is also the will of
    God that the SC made that decision you refer to and that these things are as they are. By that logic and also under paul's direction to the saints it would be against the will of god to oppose such rulings of the authorities set over us.

  • Fri Oct 02, 2009 9:45 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Criterion: What makes you think that Christians are uneducated? I am very educated at a prestigous university (Miami University (OH)--a university that has been a university since 1809). The Constitution is still vague, and yes, the Bill of Rights is as well. Nowhere does it state explicitly that God cannot be taught in public schools. The problem is, is that the United States Supreme Court made a decision some time ago that set the precedent for church v state. That is the only reason that items like this are outlawed. The thing is though, if God wanted to, and thought that it was a good time to change that precedent, He would. He has perfect will and if He so chooses, He will change the precedent. In the meantime, I'll be praying for you and that your heart will be touched in some way in the future by something that might be said on here.

  • Fri Oct 02, 2009 10:27 am Agree: 3   Disagree: 2

    " Please show where the Federal government has the jurisdiction over schools specifically spelled out in the Constitution of the United States."

    Our convoluted, power and control hungry federal government has made the determination that anything that gets federal monies is under federal control. Schools have the free lunch program and get food that qualifies as interstate commerce. Besides, liberals don't feel the need to honor the intent of the Constitution. That would only get in the way of their socialism....

  • Fri Oct 02, 2009 10:07 am Agree: 4   Disagree: 2

    1. Congress SHALL make no law respecting religion or the FREE exercise thereof.

    Period.

    2. Please show where the Federal government has the jurisdiction over schools specifically spelled out in the Constitution of the United States.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 9:17 pm Agree: 2   Disagree: 0

    Believer, good night to you also and thank you for the reasoned but faithful approach you bring to the discussion of these topics.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 9:16 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    regarding a group like FCA making the banner. In my opinion based on the case law I have reviewed and my experience such a banner would be absolutely acceptable provided that no school officials were involved in promoting it nor did the group give the appearance of official sanction.
    For example on our sports fields we have advertising banners for local individual and organization sponsors. Two churches purchase space and followed our guidlines Which are the same for all organizations. The banner can identify the sponsor or organization for example Joe's Garage or the United Methodist Church etc. and contain a declaration of support, i.e. Supports our athletes, or suppports our teams etc. Neither individuals nor organizations of any kind can make allusions to the nature or quality of their organization. For example no "Joe's Garage the home of quality service supports our team." Similarly the religious organizations cannot say "X church where Christ is lord supports our athletes". In this way we are truly neutral. We do have an exclusion for political organizations or individuals and those whose conduct or purpose is inconsistent with the mission and purpose of the schools. In this way we can refuse those running for office or engaged in other political action and for example sex offenders, and organizations such as the Clan. (by the way despite having this restriction we have never had to use it I guess they just know better than to try.
    If however the principal of the school was also president of this group and gave them preferential access to the school venues. Then no it would not be permissible. It really comes down to how the particulars relate to the principle of neutrality.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 9:10 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    viking, needless to say many do that already, have a good night!!

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 9:00 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Believer thanks for the clarification on regional customs and practices. I agree with you on the more important issues suggestion. At least this school seemed to get through the issue without wasting resources time and energy on a divisive courtroom battle like some others around the country.
    It would seem to me that a positive approach for those in the stands who feel strongly about maintaining a tradition of scripture verses would be to make there own banners and bring them with them to the games as private citizens.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:53 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    viking, question for you, if a group such as FCA is allowed to meet on campus and of course receive no funding from the schools, would it be permissible for them to have made this banner in your opinion?

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:50 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    viking, outside groups like Fellowship of Christian Athletes (FCA) have at some schools, but they have after-school programs at the school. And like I said with the cheerleaders I'm not sure they do get funding since I see so many of them having to raise their own funds for new uniforms and equipment and such, probably even the materials used to make the banners as well.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:47 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    viking, this has been a tradition at this school and I am sure at many other schools in the Bible Belt at both the high school and college level. Having lived up in Vermont I can appreciate where you're coming from, but down here in the Bible Belt the line between church and state is very blurred if not totally ignored in cases like this. When I first came back here I was a little amazed at the freedoms afforded the Christian community in the school systems here. And as much as I disagree with the opposition to this banner I'm not shocked at all to see this happen and am surprised that it hasn't happened sooner. To me personally there are much bigger issues that need to be dealt with in our schools then to worry about a banner at a football game.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:44 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Regarding what determines government funded. of course if this was a town league with teams sponsored by various buisnesses and run independent of the public school there would be no issue. But in fact I am sure it is a school team with the coaches selected by school officials paid through the school payroll etc. etc. therefore a government organized, operated and funded activity.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:41 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Believer,
    your right I don't and customs and cultures are different in different areas. Do outside groups bring the jump through banners that teams use as their entrance to the game in your area.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:39 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Regarding the question of fundraising rather than taxpayer funded purchase of uniforms or materials. That is a bit of a red herring if you think about it. Consider if I am a member of the Boy Scouts and I sell popcorn as a fundraiser for scouting activities. Don't I do this as a scout, representing the scouts, on behalf of the scouts, and the scouts are sponsoring and standing behind me in this activity. And wouldn't a sign I carried while in scout uniform, during a scout activity be interpreted as reflecting the position of the scouts. Well the same is true of this cheerleading squad. When a school sporting team carries out fundraising for a school team they act not in their private capacity but as members of the Government sanctioned and supervised team.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:38 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    viking, don't forget you don't live in football country and I have seen various groups from after school activities bring all kinds of banners to the games and on to the field.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:34 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Believer,
    Well of course those are valid questions. In my experience as someone who has been responsible for administering school extra c programs I can tell you that it would be unusual indeed for any outside group to be allowed to bring there own jump through banner onto the field. Disregarding any other issues any principal who allowed this should be disciplined for placing the school and the taxpayers at risk of liability suits. Since the players are under the supervision and care of the school officials at the time to allow a banner to be made by a group not subject to the school officials control is a guaruntee of a successfull lawsuit if one of the players were to trip while jumping through and injured themselves.
    I have in fact after more than 30 years in working in this field ever seen an independent group (school booster associations not being independent) be allowed to bring such a banner onto the field of a sporting event. It might happen but it would be a very bad idea.
    Of course the article does not say if it was a player who complained or a cheerleader or a member of the audience. Would it change your position if it was a player or a cheerleader and if so why?

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:46 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    viking, plus what determines government funded, are extra-curricular activities and groups considered to be government funded?

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:45 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    viking, plus I don't know about this school system, but in many the cheerleaders have to raise their own funds for uniforms and all their other equipment to include the materials to make these signs. At best the school might provide them with a basic uniform.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:42 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    viking, my point is, is there anything keeping anyone from making up a banner of their own and bringing it on to the field other than if it said or had something obscene on it? If not then what's the problem, did one of the players have a problem with it or is this simply another blow for political correctness? And do those people or person who complained even come out to the game?

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:52 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    And that does put the onus on other people who may not be Christian. If they're not out there praying....people are going to notice. That makes for some uncomfortable football players to be singled out as being different.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:51 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Oh, and not only do the football players pray while wearing uniforms paid for by the govrnment (actually, they are paid for by our taxes), but they also pray ON A FIELD THAT IS PROPERTY OF THE GOVERNMENT.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:47 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    The situation with the cheerleading situation is about the fact that the cheerleaders, as students of the school and being leaders of a school sponsored activity (cheerleading), they are in fact "spokespeople" for the school.
    That is no different than football players who, as students and leaders of a school sponsored activity, engage in prayer while wearing a football uniform paid for by the government. Interesting how some people can differentiate the two, when they are no different.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:37 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    Hi Curtis you ask
    Someone please explain to me how player-initiated prayer on the field of play before and after the game is any different from a cheerleader-initiated sign?

    While not a lawyer I have to deal with this in my work so I will try.
    1. The player is not asking for the government to provide the funding and materials for the creation of the banner as is the case with most run through banners.(government sponsorship)
    2.The player when offering a personal prayer even aloud is still commiting an act of individual thanksgiving, supplication, devotion or praise not preaching or proseletysing to others. A sign on the other hand has the purpose of communicating a message to other persons not to god and thus is primarily a form of preaching.
    3. The election by a player or cheerleader to pray does not create any onus or compulsion on others to participate in that act of faith. The Cheerleaders jump through banner on the other hand presents teammembers with a forced choice of participating in the religious conduct or being excluded from a portion of the official activities and functions of the government sponsored cheering squad further it presents the players with a forced choice to jump through the banner or to be set apart because of a conflicting religious belief.

    These are just a few of the critical distinctions between the two situations you present.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:18 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Hi Believer I assume you put forward the suggestion

    Here's an idea, why not have two run through banners, for those players who realize that their athletic abilities come ultimately from God they can run through this banner and for those players who think it's all about them they can run through one that has the title from Frank Sinatra's song, "I Did It My Way" painted on it.

    tongue in cheek otherwise you would have included a banner for jewish students, a banner for hindu students, a banner for moslem students, a banner for quaker students (what are they doing on a football field), a banner for Latter Day Saints, a banner for shinto students, a banner for Wiccan students, etc. etc. etc.

    The very way the suggestion is presented (as if there were only two possible religious positions), amply demonstrates why the supreme court has issued the rulings it has.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:02 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Logic,

    You said, "However, the question becomes what if the cheerleaders, or members of the marching band, in their school uniforms, went into the stands at some point during the game and held up the signs? I think an argument could be made that the audience would equally perceive this as school sponsored endorsement, just like what I think is going on in this current case."

    The problem is, everybody KNOWS this isn't a school-sponsored event, but something the cheerleaders wanted to do on their own. The principal has forbidden the activity. Therefore, the argument that this might be percieved as school-sponsored is foolish.

    Nonetheless, the girls have had their ability to express (a pretty mild religious statement, by the way) taken away from them. The school (state) has thus endorsed the religious practice of 'no religion'.

    "Do not be decieved; God cannot be mocked. A man shall reap what he sows."

    All the citations of case law in the world won't make a wrong, right. Abortion is legal, but it is still murder. And putting on a cheerleader uniform should not make a student a de facto athiest. The idea of separation of religious belief from religious action is moronic at best. What is religion if not a set of beliefs by which we act?

    The Bible says, "run the race as to win." So from now on, when coaches tell their students to try to win races, they are violating the first amendment. Eh? And the Bible says, "You shall not steal." Another violation. And so on. Wait, I have an idea. Let's take the 10 commandments out of the schools, and quit telling the kids to live moral lives (1962). Take a look at what has happened to our culture since 1962.

    (Can you see why I have such disdain for your precious case law? I suppose not...)

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 2:11 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 0

    How about the song by the Grateful Dead "Hell In A Bucket"? LOL

    "I may be going to hell in a bucket, babe, But at least I'm enjoying the ride."

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:45 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Believer,

    Hahahahaha. I love that idea! Then no one can complain. ROFL.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:22 pm Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Here's an idea, why not have two run through banners, for those players who realize that their athletic abilities come ultimately from God they can run through this banner and for those players who think it's all about them they can run through one that has the title from Frank Sinatra's song, "I Did It My Way" painted on it.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 12:48 pm Agree: 0   Disagree: 1

    Hi Viking,

    Yes, you are right. I did not phrase what I wanted to say properly. If students, privately in the stands at the game, held up the same signs, I suspect, it would not be considered government endorsement. However, the question becomes what if the cheerleaders, or members of the marching band, in their school uniforms, went into the stands at some point during the game and held up the signs? I think an argument could be made that the audience would equally perceive this as school sponsored endorsement, just like what I think is going on in this current case.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 12:45 pm Agree: 3   Disagree: 1

    What happened to the good ol' days when the disciples preached the good news boldly, even to the end of being incarcerated and killed?
    I suppose we have lost the true passion for Jesus Christ.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:23 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    "LFO Principal Jerry Ransom supports the banners but said the school has to "adhere to what the Supreme Court and federal courts have ruled on."

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Even if it goes against the first amendment?

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:22 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    What the school, and the government, is trying to do is slowly choke out our right to free speech. We must stand for our right to speak out anywhere we want.

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:50 am Agree: 2   Disagree: 1

    Majority of the Americans can't read the writing on the
    wall, that God has sent a judgment upon the land for
    our pride and lack of fear in Him. Bible and the
    ten commandments are taken out from public places, prayer
    from the school, and a whole lot of things were
    happening for the last few years. While countries like
    India and China are growing fast but America is in deeper
    economic troubles. When we read God's hand writing?

  • Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:41 am Agree: 1   Disagree: 0

    Someone please explain to me how player-initiated prayer on the field of play before and after the game is any different from a cheerleader-initiated sign?

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